Episode 60

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Published on:

14th May 2025

60: Infertility and How to Support Women Going Through it | Alli Kalina

Mari and her dear friend Alli, talk about the topic of supporting women through infertility and pregnancy loss. In this heartfelt conversation, they discuss their personal journeys, the importance of friendship, and offer insights into how to genuinely support those grappling with these challenges. From sharing the hardest aspects of their experiences to addressing the delicate approach needed when announcing pregnancies, Mari and Ali provide valuable advice for loved ones wanting to help. This episode is great for anyone looking to understand and support the women in their lives who are struggling with infertility or pregnancy loss.

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Transcript
Speaker:

Hey, I am your host, Mari Wagner,

and you're listening to The Ever Be

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Podcast where Faith Meets Lifestyle.

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I'm so excited you're here.

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Whether you're a new listener

or a longtime follower, I know

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there's something here for you.

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Pull up a chair and listen in for

insightful, real life conversations and

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actionable steps on how to claim the.

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Full life God created you for.

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If you're a woman desiring to live

a Christ-centered life in today's

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modern world, then this is for you.

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Welcome to ever be.

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mari-x-alli_6_05-13-2025_161346:

Welcome back everybody.

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We have a live ever Be recording

with a very special guest today.

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And by live I mean like I am live

in person with my dear friend Ali.

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We are not recording this and

putting this out live unfortunately.

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But um, it's gonna be

a great conversation.

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I have Ally on the podcast today.

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She's a dear friend.

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She happens to be my neighbor.

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I'll let her introduce herself as well,

but we are gonna be chatting about how

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to support friends, family members,

basically just women in your life who are

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suffering with the cross of infertility

or pregnancy loss, um, in this season.

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And just, just women that are

struggling on their motherhood

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journey, um, struggling to get there.

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It's a very heavy cross and

something that I've opened up.

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On my Instagram a little bit.

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Um, and I've gotten a lot of requests

lately of people asking, I have friends

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in my life who are going through this.

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Mm-hmm.

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Like, what do I say?

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How do I support them?

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How do I make them feel loved?

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Um, and I think with Mother's Day,

just recently passing, I had a few

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people in my life who were just so

loving and supportive that I just felt

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like I wanna share this with people.

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I want people to know,

like how to support women.

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So I brought Ally on the podcast today.

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Um, ally, welcome.

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Thanks Ma.

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Do you wanna introduce a

little bit about who you are?

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Maybe how we know each other?

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Yeah.

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And what you do in your day-to-day

life, just so people can get

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to know you a little bit.

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That sounds great.

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Um, like Mari said, my name's Allie

and I traveled a super long ways

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to be here, just across the street.

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Um, we're neighbors.

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Um, we've been neighbors

for like a year now.

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Yeah.

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But yeah, I, I guess like what

do I do to the day to day?

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I'm a focus parish missionary,

so I actually work at MAs Parish.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, but we met because we moved into

the house, across the street from them.

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Mm-hmm.

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And we're super excited when we found out

that there were other focus missionaries

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who, well, former focus missionaries.

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Yeah.

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Who lived across the street.

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So one of our good friends introduced.

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Us to each other.

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Yes.

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Mutual friend.

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We had a mutual friend who,

his name is Zach Fiedler.

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Yes.

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Shout out, out to Zach.

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Great.

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Like photographer if you Yeah.

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Wanna follow him.

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And he had stayed with

us like two summers ago.

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Mm-hmm.

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And then he was coming to stay

with you guys last summer.

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Yeah.

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And he is like, oh my gosh, my friends

are moving in right in front of you.

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And I'd heard of your husband before.

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Mm-hmm.

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Because he's on the

Catholic Instagram world.

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Yeah.

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And I was like, this is

so fun, like, so crazy.

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What are the odds?

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That like two married couples

that are like in the Catholic

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content creation world.

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Yeah.

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Focus missionary world.

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Right.

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Like, you know what I mean?

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Yeah.

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And also both on like very, um, just

like fertility journeys right now.

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Totally.

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Like at the same time.

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Yeah.

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It's just really crazy that

the Lord brought us together.

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It is crazy.

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Yeah.

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So we moved in across the street.

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I feel like a few months into that Mari's

like, I'm gonna start this Bible study.

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Yes, please come.

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And I was like, of course I'll be there.

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So Mari and I have kind of gotten to

know each other over the past year

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and it's just been super beautiful.

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Mm-hmm.

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Like Mari said, like sharing some

of our struggles with fertility.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, and being able to

like, walk with that.

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Yeah.

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Walk with each other through that.

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Mm-hmm.

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Yeah, it's been an amazing support.

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Yeah.

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Um, do you wanna just tell us a little

bit about, about your fertility journey?

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Yeah.

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Just like, you know, how long

have you guys been trying?

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Mm-hmm.

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And what does that look like for you?

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Yeah, so Tanner and I have been

married for almost three years.

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Woo.

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Which is so crazy.

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Three years in July.

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Uh, and yeah, we've been like very open

to life since the day we got married.

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Um, I know Mari shared similar things,

but like always expected that we would

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just like get pregnant right away 'cause

that's what marriage in a Catholic world

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just seems like it happens that way.

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Uh, and.

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We like struggled a little bit for

like the first six months, but a lot

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of people told us like, it takes time.

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Mm-hmm.

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So we weren't super worried about it.

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Uh, and then in the time of being

married, almost three years, uh,

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we've just had lots of surgeries.

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Mm-hmm.

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Lots of doctor's appointments.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, we've unfortunately had two

pregnancy losses in the three

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years that we've been married.

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Uh, and yeah, just like our eyes

have been opened a lot to like

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what fertility actually looks like.

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Yeah.

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So we're super passionate

about talking about it as well.

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Because I think it needs

to be talked about more.

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Yeah.

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And you've recently started, my gosh,

Instagram, didn't you Ali share about it?

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Yeah, do it.

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Um, I don't even know

what to say about it.

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I've like been so MIA

on Instagram, I guess.

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Yeah.

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Like since lunch.

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Well, because you, you

also took it off for Lens.

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Yeah.

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So like, don't expect it to be like a

super, like popping a camera right now.

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But Yeah, it has very not,

it's the potential to be.

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Yeah.

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Just tell us like what is the handle?

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Yeah.

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Why did you start it?

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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So it's called Blessed to Hope.

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Um, and it kind of came out of like

the fruit of losing our second baby.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, we just felt super convicted

about just like what even is hope.

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Um, and then like expanding kind of

the conversation around fertility,

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especially in the Catholic world,

even in the Christian world.

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It's just something that's

not talked about enough.

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And so we're hoping to kind of like go to

places that people don't really wanna go

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when it comes to talking about fertility.

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Yeah.

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That's so good.

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Yeah, and that's exactly why

I brought you here today.

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There we go.

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Um, okay.

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To start off this conversation, why don't

we just chat a little bit about, um.

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In our experience.

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Mm-hmm.

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What has been maybe one of the hardest

things that we've had to kind of face

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or grapple with throughout this journey?

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Yeah.

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I think there's obviously a lot

of difficulties with this journey.

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Mm-hmm.

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And a lot of different ways that it

can be difficult on different women.

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Yeah.

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Um, but for you and for me personally,

maybe what are, what have been

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like one of the hardest things that

you've had to kind of just grapple

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with throughout this journey?

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I feel like.

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For us, just like being

kind of like let down.

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Yeah.

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Like constantly.

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Mm-hmm.

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You know?

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And like having this expectation

that it's gonna like happen right

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away is like really defeating

when it didn't happen right away.

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Mm-hmm.

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So I think like overall just

struggling with fertility in general.

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Just like this constant

waiting for something.

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Mm-hmm.

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And like kind of feeling like you

have to be like, yeah, just like

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only focused on the next nine months.

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Yeah, it's like a really hard thing to

do when you're married and especially

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if you're struggling with fertility.

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Mm-hmm.

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So I think waiting, um, and then with

like pregnancy loss, just like really

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wrestling with the Lord in that.

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Oh yeah.

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You know, I feel like there's like

few things in this life that will

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like, shake you to the core, like.

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Losing a child, right?

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Yeah.

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Whether it's like the child's

like been with you like on

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this side of heaven mm-hmm.

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For a while.

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Or like, yeah, you've been pregnant

for a little bit, you lose a child.

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Like yeah.

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It just really shakes your faith.

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So I think both of those things waiting,

being in a season of waiting for like an

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like infinite amount of time, like you

don't know when the deadline's gonna be.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, and then just struggling with like

your relationship with the Lord amidst.

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Loss.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I think both of those are really tough.

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Yeah.

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And I definitely relate to that

second one you're talking about.

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Um, we have been struggling

for a little over three years.

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Yeah.

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And I think the hardest part

for me is just that question

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of like, will this ever happen?

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Yeah.

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And it's just the unknown.

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Totally.

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And I think that at first

in the journey it was.

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A little bit easier to be like,

kinda what you're saying, like,

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oh, it's only been six months.

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Like some people, you know, it

takes them a little bit longer.

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And we saw for the first doctor,

and the first doctor was a little

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dismissive and like, oh, you're fine.

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Mm-hmm.

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Just come back in six months.

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Like, I'm sure you'll be pregnant.

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And then you have a year go

by and you're like, okay.

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Like, does it really

take that much longer?

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But then, you know, you find maybe

another answer here and, and the,

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the months just start to add up.

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And I think the, the more they

add up, the more you just are

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left to wonder, like, is this.

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Is this even in the cards for me?

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Mm.

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Like, does the Lord even actually

have this planned in his, um, yeah.

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Just grand planned plan of life.

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Um, and just wrestling with like,

I know that these desires are

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good and that the Lord like has

placed these desires on my heart.

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Mm-hmm.

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And so it's like part of me, like needs to

trust in that and like the Lord places a

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desire of motherhood on my heart and he.

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Gave me the vocation that like

supposedly leads to motherhood.

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Um, but really having to trust in his

plan and his timing, and trusting that

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if he does want me to be a mother,

you know, beyond a spiritual mother to

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people in my life, when will that be?

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And yeah, just like that trust,

that faith, that hope and that

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waiting period, like trying to be as

faithful as possible in that waiting

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period until that time comes around.

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Yeah.

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Um, and then.

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Yes.

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What you said too about like how much

it like shakes your faith and I think

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stretches your relationship with the Lord.

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Yeah.

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Um, the medical things, the procedures,

all that is tough and it's hard.

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Mm-hmm.

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But for someone who.

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I love the Lord so much.

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And I think that there have been times

where I have just been shocked at just

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like how my faith has been shaken.

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Yeah.

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And that's hard for me.

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It's hard for me to be okay with

myself, like sitting in a chair and

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like questioning God and fighting with

God and being like, how did I get here?

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Yeah.

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Like, don't I have enough faith?

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Don't I trust?

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Like what happened?

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You know what I mean?

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Totally.

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But um.

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I think I've talked about this before.

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Um, I know I talked about it in my, I

think I talked about it in my seek talk or

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something, but one of my favorite quotes,

I think I've told you this, is from St.

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Fina's diary where Jesus tells her

that suffering is a great gift because

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in suffering, love is crystallized.

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Ooh, love that.

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Like love is purified

and it's strengthened.

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Yeah, and I think of like a diamond, like

crystallized, like a diamond where it's

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like diamonds are so strong, but they like

go through this process of like growing.

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Yeah.

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And like, you know what I mean?

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Uhhuh.

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And so in a way it's like, wow, like my

faith has gone through just the turmoil,

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you know, dragged through the mud,

cleaned off, hung up to dry, and then.

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Yeah.

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Like highs and lows, but I, I trust in

the depths of my heart, like a diamond is

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coming outta this, you know what I mean?

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Yeah.

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In my faith.

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Yeah.

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No, I can definitely relate to that.

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I feel like that's like been one beautiful

thing that's come out of all this is like

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my hope has become so much more strong.

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Mm-hmm.

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And like, yeah, Tanner and I

have had so many conversations

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about this, but just like.

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Yeah.

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What was my hope actually in Yeah.

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And like it's made me like realize like

my hope has to be in eternity with God.

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Yeah.

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Like that's what it has to be rooted in.

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'cause everything else is so fleeting.

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Mm-hmm.

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But it's Right.

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I feel like people who carry this

cross, like, yeah, it really does.

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Like strengthen your

relationship with the Lord.

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Mm-hmm.

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And shake things up.

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Yeah.

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That's really beautiful.

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I think through this whole journey

though, I have had friends, um,

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and family who have expressed like

obviously their, um, just like

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that their heart goes out mm-hmm.

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To me and that they, they want to learn

how to love me through this process.

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Yeah.

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And I do think it is.

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I don't know.

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It's just a particularly

interesting situation.

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Yeah.

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Especially in the season of life that

we're in, where we're married and

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everybody around us is having kids.

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Yeah.

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Um, and so we're constantly

exposed to families, pregnancy

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announcements, baby showers.

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Mm-hmm.

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Baptisms.

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All the things.

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All the things, yeah.

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Um, and I think, yeah, those friends

and families, friends and family that

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like really know you, really love

you, like they're aware of, of that,

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and they wanna learn how to just

like, love you and support you so.

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I think in general, what is a

truly like supportive friendship

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look like through this process?

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Yeah.

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I feel like sometimes like, it can be

easy, like as a friend, supporting someone

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walking through this to feel like you

have to like do all the right things.

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Mm-hmm.

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Or like, you know, you don't

wanna say the wrong thing.

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Mm-hmm.

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And like, it can almost like

stifle your friendship in a sense.

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Yeah.

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And so, like, not being like overly

aware of it, I think is a good thing.

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But also being like, you know, aware

enough of the situation where you can

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like check in and ask questions about it.

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Yeah.

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You know, I think like one thing that

I'm sure you've experienced this too,

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is just like feeling very lonely mm-hmm.

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In all of this.

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Mm-hmm.

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Like, like Mar said, like

you're surrounded by people

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who are having babies.

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There's baby showers, there's pregnancy

announcements, there's everything.

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So like, if you're a friend walking

with someone who's struggling with

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this, just like checking in with them

to be like, how are you really doing?

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, you know, like even, like what's an

update for you if you wanna share one.

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Yeah.

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Um.

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I feel like that's been a huge gift for

you guys and for us to like have you

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guys across the street is like, yeah.

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Like what's going on with you guys?

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Like what's an update?

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You know?

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Yeah.

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And being able to like

share that really freely.

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Um, but yeah, if you have a friend

just like checking in on them mm-hmm.

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And seeing how they're doing.

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Yeah.

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And I liked what you said too about, I

can't remember quite how you worded it,

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but like doing like being aware mm-hmm.

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Of the sensitivity of the subject and

checking in, but almost not overdoing it.

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Yeah.

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And I think obviously it

always comes from a very good.

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Intention in a very good place.

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Yeah.

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But I do feel like there have been

times in relationships where you

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almost feel like there is a shift or

there is a cycling when somebody's

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so overly worried about what they're

gonna say or what they're gonna do.

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Yeah.

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Um, especially if they have children.

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Mm-hmm.

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I think that it's been difficult

sometimes because people feel

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like, well, maybe I can't, like.

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Share pictures of my kids.

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Yeah.

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Or like tell you about how they're doing.

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'cause I don't wanna make you feel bad.

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Mm-hmm.

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Um, which again, I know is

coming from a great place.

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Yeah.

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But also like as a friend, I

genuinely am like, I genuinely

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wanna know about your life.

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Yes.

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And like, your life is

motherhood right now.

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Yeah.

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You know, so like, I

do wanna hear about it.

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So I think there is like, need to check

in, but also like, don't make that every.

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Conversation.

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Yeah.

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Every conversation or every catch up

you have with a friend, I think it's

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important to say that, where it's like

check in, but not every time you call

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or every time you hang out, because

then it just makes it all about that.

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That totally.

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And while it's like good to have a

friend that you feel like you can

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confide in, even if you can confide

in someone, it's like you don't

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wanna talk about it all the time.

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Right.

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You know?

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Yeah.

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And like, just like another note too

is that like, I think you kind of

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were getting there with this is like.

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We don't wanna feel left out.

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Yeah.

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You know what I mean?

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Like just because like we

both carry like this cross.

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Mm-hmm.

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And it's really hard.

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Doesn't mean like Yeah.

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We don't wanna be a part of your

life still if you have children.

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Like we obviously both

really love children, right?

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Yes.

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We wouldn't be talking

about this if you didn't.

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Yes.

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Like invite me to the park if you are

going the park with your mom friends.

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Yes.

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It's totally, I'd be happy.

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:

Show, show us the pictures of

your baby's first birthday party.

442

:

You know what I mean?

443

:

Yes.

444

:

Like we wanna be a part of that.

445

:

So like, not feeling left out.

446

:

Mm-hmm.

447

:

And then something that I've been

really like kind of wrestling with

448

:

over the last couple of years is.

449

:

There's like a balance between

like, I don't wanna feel pitied.

450

:

You know?

451

:

Mm-hmm.

452

:

And so, like, if you're my

friend, like your presence, like

453

:

matters more than your pity to me.

454

:

Mm-hmm.

455

:

Uh, and so like, yeah.

456

:

What Mari's saying is like checking in,

but like, yeah, we like know this is a

457

:

cross, but like everyone also suffers.

458

:

Yes.

459

:

So like we all have suffering.

460

:

Um, and we don't need to be

like pitied for our suffering.

461

:

Yeah.

462

:

You know?

463

:

For sure.

464

:

I think that's something that I've

been like wrestling with a lot.

465

:

Yeah.

466

:

Yeah.

467

:

What are some things that you feel like.

468

:

Are helpful to say to a friend.

469

:

And what are some things that you

feel like maybe have been said to

470

:

you in the past that maybe like the

person was trying to be helpful,

471

:

but it just didn't land quite right.

472

:

Yeah.

473

:

Some things that maybe weren't

as helpful that you're like,

474

:

maybe don't say that to somebody.

475

:

Oh, it's so hard.

476

:

'cause I feel like most people

come from such a good place.

477

:

I know.

478

:

Um, but I do think at the same

time, um, when we like have live

479

:

in a Catholic culture right now

where we're kind of like combating.

480

:

A lot of like what our worldly culture

says about like pregnancy and like

481

:

being a mom and all these things that

we kind of sway to the way other end.

482

:

Mm-hmm.

483

:

Um, and so like, it's almost like

when someone is going through this,

484

:

like you would never assume that.

485

:

Yeah.

486

:

Um, so yeah, there's a lot of things, but

I think something that I have a really

487

:

good friend, she was actually a student

when I was a focus missionary, who's

488

:

become like one of my great friends.

489

:

Um, she is just like such a good listener.

490

:

Um, and like after our second loss, she

came over and she basically just sat down

491

:

and I told her about it and she goes.

492

:

I want like you to share as much as

you want or as little as you want.

493

:

Mm.

494

:

And like whenever you're ready

to stop, like you can stop.

495

:

Yeah.

496

:

And like that was so freeing to me.

497

:

So freeing to be like, she's not

gonna like dig to ask more questions

498

:

if I don't wanna like share more.

499

:

Yeah.

500

:

But she's like willing to hear everything.

501

:

Yeah.

502

:

I want to share like she's

willing to hear it all out.

503

:

Like even if it's like an hour of

you, like decompressing totally

504

:

everything you're feeling like

she wants to be there for that.

505

:

Right.

506

:

And even if I were to share a

little bit, she'd be like, that's.

507

:

What you needed to share.

508

:

Yeah.

509

:

You know, so I think like asking

questions that like are maybe

510

:

like a little more open-ended.

511

:

Mm-hmm.

512

:

And not asking questions that are

like very specific to your journey.

513

:

Yes.

514

:

Yeah.

515

:

Yeah.

516

:

Because most likely if someone's your good

is your good friend, they will share that.

517

:

If they want to share that, you know?

518

:

Yeah.

519

:

They're gonna, yeah.

520

:

Like most likely it'll open up and be

like, Hey, here's what we're doing next.

521

:

Exactly.

522

:

Like prayers, like asking

for prayers for that.

523

:

Totally.

524

:

Like, I think like the default should

be to be like, be more open-ended

525

:

than to be like niche questions.

526

:

Yeah.

527

:

Yeah.

528

:

I think some things that, um, have

been said that, that haven't been

529

:

as helpful that I can think of.

530

:

Um.

531

:

When you compare, and this could

go for anybody's suffering, right?

532

:

I guess like when you compare

your suffering to something

533

:

else that like might be worse.

534

:

Mm.

535

:

And so when people are like,

you know, I know this is really

536

:

hard, like we should be grateful,

at least you don't have cancer.

537

:

Right.

538

:

Or like, oh, like Right.

539

:

There's so many things to be grateful for.

540

:

Yeah.

541

:

Like at least you X, Y, Z.

542

:

Right?

543

:

Yeah.

544

:

And I think that's been hard

for me to receive in the past.

545

:

'cause I'm like.

546

:

I totally like am so grateful, you

know, for my health in general, for

547

:

all the blessings, but it almost feels

like it's diminishing the cross in that

548

:

moment of just like, you don't have to

be as sad as you think you do, because

549

:

at least you don't have something else.

550

:

Right.

551

:

Have you ever had people say that to you?

552

:

Yeah.

553

:

I feel like anything that's like

super dismissive of what you're

554

:

going through, dismissive is a

good word, is so hurtful, you know?

555

:

Mm-hmm.

556

:

And especially like if you're willing

to like open up to somebody about like.

557

:

Suffering that you're experiencing.

558

:

Mm-hmm.

559

:

And then someone dismisses it.

560

:

It's like, oh, come on.

561

:

Yeah.

562

:

You just kind of instantly

regret saying anything.

563

:

Yeah, totally.

564

:

You're like, I should have

just never said anything.

565

:

Yeah, yeah.

566

:

Um, but yeah, I think like when

you're walking like the cross of like

567

:

infertility, like there's so many things

that you could say that would probably

568

:

be hurtful to someone like Uhhuh.

569

:

You know, like maybe

you're just not ready yet.

570

:

I've heard that one a lot.

571

:

Oh, yes.

572

:

And that one just like

cuts you to the core.

573

:

You know, you're like,

what does that mean?

574

:

It's like God's waiting for

like you to learn something new.

575

:

It's not God's time, you know?

576

:

Mm-hmm.

577

:

Yeah.

578

:

Things like that.

579

:

And like you said, that you could

really apply this to like probably

580

:

a lot of different suffering.

581

:

Yeah.

582

:

Um.

583

:

But yeah, those are big ones.

584

:

Or you could always adopt,

like Yes, that's a big one too.

585

:

That I think is very common, again,

comes from such a good place.

586

:

Mm-hmm.

587

:

Um, I think it's, it's hard for

people going through infertility

588

:

to hear that sometimes because

there's so, it's so much deeper.

589

:

Adoption is so much deeper than I think

what a lot of people see on the surface.

590

:

Totally.

591

:

And.

592

:

It's a process and it's not an

easy bandaid, like coverup, like,

593

:

first of all, not every family's

going to be called to adopt.

594

:

Right.

595

:

And even if you do, it doesn't

replace that deep longing and

596

:

ache for a biological child.

597

:

So it doesn't, it doesn't just like

replace that and make everything better.

598

:

Yeah.

599

:

Um, which I think is not,

is not commonly understood.

600

:

Yeah.

601

:

Also, I feel like in

our culture, like just.

602

:

This like desire to like

have things immediately.

603

:

Mm-hmm.

604

:

And like fix problems immediately.

605

:

Mm-hmm.

606

:

Is just like not a good one.

607

:

Like sometimes it's okay

that we like That's true.

608

:

Yeah, just like, like you said,

adoption's, like a discernment and

609

:

it's not like a solution to your

ache for like biological children.

610

:

Yeah, yeah.

611

:

You know, while it's a good discernment

and I think we should all discern that.

612

:

Yeah.

613

:

Um.

614

:

Yeah.

615

:

It's not just like a quick fix.

616

:

Mm-hmm.

617

:

To your longings.

618

:

Mm-hmm.

619

:

I think on the other hand, some

things that people have said that

620

:

have been helpful and encouraging

to me, I think people definitely

621

:

struggle with what to say.

622

:

Oh, for sure.

623

:

And I think people feel at a

loss for words a lot of the time.

624

:

Yeah.

625

:

Which I think is totally like fine.

626

:

Like Yeah.

627

:

In all reality.

628

:

Nothing anybody says is going

to like, make the pain go away.

629

:

Right, right.

630

:

Or fix the problem.

631

:

Yeah.

632

:

But it can be comforting to

just to say something with love,

633

:

something with just like Yeah.

634

:

Just a good intention.

635

:

For example, like for me, even

though it's a very much a cliche,

636

:

I love when people say like, I know

God has such a good plan for you.

637

:

Mm-hmm.

638

:

Yeah.

639

:

Like, just to be reassured of that.

640

:

'cause that's a truth.

641

:

Yeah.

642

:

That like.

643

:

That is just fundamental truth.

644

:

Right.

645

:

But it can be hard, like it can be

easily, you can be easily shaken in that.

646

:

Yeah.

647

:

In this journey you can easily

be like, what is God's plan?

648

:

Did he, you know, abandon me?

649

:

Yeah.

650

:

Like, did he just forget that I'm

out here like praying for motherhood?

651

:

Yeah.

652

:

But when somebody comes and just

reminds me like, yeah, I know God

653

:

has an amazing plan for you and your

family, whatever that looks like,

654

:

that's always comforting for me.

655

:

Yeah.

656

:

Because I think that's like the

truth that gets attacked a lot

657

:

when you're struggling with this.

658

:

Mm-hmm.

659

:

You're like.

660

:

Like all these things go through

your head like, God isn't good.

661

:

Like he doesn't have a good plan for me.

662

:

Like he's not listening

to me, all these things.

663

:

Mm-hmm.

664

:

So I think like having someone

like gently reassure you.

665

:

Mm-hmm.

666

:

Like even like when you're

not like asking for it.

667

:

Right.

668

:

Like when you're not like expressing

those concerns, but like someone

669

:

coming up to me like God has a

really good plan for you more.

670

:

Yeah.

671

:

Like it, you're right.

672

:

It is really reassuring.

673

:

I think also like it just depends on

like the cross you're carrying with this.

674

:

'cause like when it comes to pregnancy

loss, like there's a whole other

675

:

plethora of things that people could say.

676

:

Yeah.

677

:

That could be really hurtful too.

678

:

Yeah.

679

:

Um, do you want me to share

something like what Yeah.

680

:

Share, but people need to know.

681

:

Yeah.

682

:

I mean, I, this is like one that

I will just always share because I

683

:

think it's a really important one.

684

:

Yeah.

685

:

And I, I don't ever hear anyone

else say this, but one of the, like,

686

:

most piercing questions I've gotten

from very well inte intentioned

687

:

people is how far along were you?

688

:

Hmm.

689

:

Like, I immediately, like,

it's like I shared like.

690

:

I had a miscarriage and they're

like, oh, how far along were you?

691

:

And it's almost like, like as if that

would be like important knowledge to know.

692

:

Yeah, that's so true.

693

:

And like it would change the way that

they like approach the situation somehow.

694

:

Right.

695

:

Some people would change the weight of,

of how, how hard it was, was for you.

696

:

Yeah.

697

:

And like I said, very well-intentioned

question, I think because totally.

698

:

Like, you know, when someone's pregnant,

that's a question you ask a lot.

699

:

Um, but like, man, it cuts deep.

700

:

'cause it makes you feel like,

oh man, am I like making this a

701

:

bigger deal than it really is.

702

:

But like we know like as Catholics

that like any life is like.

703

:

Of great importance, right?

704

:

It's a life, it's your child.

705

:

Yeah.

706

:

So I think like, avoid that question.

707

:

Yeah.

708

:

If someone wants to share that

with you, they absolutely will.

709

:

Um, so that's a hard one.

710

:

I think also similar to like just

infertility in general, but like I.

711

:

Even just saying like, oh, maybe

it's like in God's timing or plan.

712

:

Mm.

713

:

And it's like, oh, to say that

to someone who just like lost a

714

:

baby, like that's not actually

God's plan, um, for a baby to die.

715

:

Right.

716

:

And, and that's so hard

to grapple with too.

717

:

It, of just like, now you've

opened up a can of worms of

718

:

like, now I have to wonder, why

would that have been God's plan?

719

:

Right.

720

:

You know's.

721

:

Exactly.

722

:

And like, yeah.

723

:

Um, that gets into a whole thing

about suffering and like why

724

:

bad things happen, things like

that, which we all struggle with.

725

:

Yeah, exactly.

726

:

But I think that's like also a good,

a good thing to maybe kind of like

727

:

avoid or just tread gently with.

728

:

What about, um, well at

least you can get pregnant.

729

:

At least you know you can get pregnant.

730

:

Yes.

731

:

Yes.

732

:

We've actually had people say

that to us, and that's so hard.

733

:

Right.

734

:

I, I bet that's hard.

735

:

Um, I even like had a family member, like

we were walking through our house and I

736

:

just like, probably shouldn't have said

this, but in the moment I was like, oh,

737

:

like this would've been our baby's room.

738

:

Aw.

739

:

You know?

740

:

And that person was

like, well, the next one.

741

:

And I'm like, no, but

like, we wanted this one.

742

:

You know?

743

:

Yeah.

744

:

So, yeah, I think.

745

:

It's easy to, like, I don't wanna get too

in the weeds 'cause I don't want people

746

:

to feel like they can't say anything.

747

:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

748

:

Um, but, but these are like

some big ones that I feel like

749

:

are just good to be aware of.

750

:

Yeah.

751

:

Just to be aware of.

752

:

Um, but yeah, I think like.

753

:

Yeah, you ought to like balance it with,

you know, I think also receiving things

754

:

from people like with a grain of salt.

755

:

Absolutely.

756

:

Yeah.

757

:

We can get into that later, I'm sure.

758

:

But yeah, I think, um, one other thing too

that has been very healing for me to hear,

759

:

so on the flip side, something that's been

helpful to hear is, I've had a few people

760

:

say this, um, the first time I ever.

761

:

Heard it was actually the doctor

that I'm working with now.

762

:

Like the first time I like kind

of like told her everything.

763

:

The day that I met her.

764

:

Yeah.

765

:

And everything we had gone through

and she put her hand on my shoulder,

766

:

which first of all I feel like is just

not very common for doctors to do.

767

:

Yeah.

768

:

Right.

769

:

And it was just so reassuring.

770

:

She put her hand on my shoulder and

she looked at me and she goes, ma,

771

:

you are ready being such a good mother

to your children, that's so good.

772

:

Like, I know it makes

me tear up every time.

773

:

Yeah.

774

:

Because she was like, everything

you're doing right now.

775

:

Mm-hmm.

776

:

All of this like.

777

:

Research and lifestyle changes.

778

:

Yeah.

779

:

And medical work.

780

:

Right.

781

:

And everything you're doing to like

heal your body and find the root

782

:

cause and like prepare yourself to be

the best, like to like, uh, vessel.

783

:

Yeah.

784

:

Vessel for this life.

785

:

Like all of that and all your suffering

like that is being a good mother.

786

:

Like that is your motherly heart coming

out, wanting to care for your children

787

:

even now, before they come into the world.

788

:

That was just, I mean,

immediately when she said that

789

:

to me, I'm just like bawling.

790

:

'cause like I just.

791

:

Felt so seen in that moment mm-hmm.

792

:

To have somebody acknowledge like you

do have a maternal heart, you know?

793

:

Yeah.

794

:

Because I think right now, in the

midst of so many people having children

795

:

and becoming moms, right, it can be

hard to like feed, to be in a room of

796

:

mothers and be like, wow, like they're

all mothers and like, and I'm not.

797

:

You know, you're like one of

the most maternal people I know.

798

:

You really are.

799

:

You do have a maternal heart.

800

:

Aw, thank you.

801

:

It's very apparent.

802

:

Thank you.

803

:

But you're so right.

804

:

It's easy to feel like that.

805

:

Just to be, yeah.

806

:

Be like, just to be reassured in that for

somebody who desires motherhood so much.

807

:

Yes.

808

:

Or for someone who, like you are a

mother, you have children in heaven,

809

:

and to be reassured of just like of

that motherly heart that you do have.

810

:

Yeah.

811

:

Mm-hmm.

812

:

I feel like is.

813

:

It's very comforting.

814

:

Yeah.

815

:

And just to have your friends, like

see the sacrifices you're making now.

816

:

Yeah.

817

:

You know what I mean?

818

:

I feel like it's very easy to like

see the sacrifices of a mother who

819

:

has like three toddlers, right?

820

:

Mm-hmm.

821

:

But like to see like your

doctor, just acknowledging the

822

:

sacrifices you're making Yes.

823

:

For your future family.

824

:

Yeah.

825

:

Is so affirming.

826

:

It's so affirming.

827

:

Totally.

828

:

So that's so beautiful.

829

:

Okay.

830

:

Shifting gears a little bit, um, let's

talk about announcing a pregnancy.

831

:

Mm-hmm.

832

:

Um, I feel like this news

can be hard to receive Yeah.

833

:

When you're going through

infertility or have experienced loss.

834

:

Um, but it's inevitable, right?

835

:

There's like life growing all around us.

836

:

Yeah.

837

:

And there's part of us that genuinely like

is happy for those people and wants to

838

:

celebrate, but then also part of us that

has like needs space to mourn as well.

839

:

Mm-hmm.

840

:

So what do you feel like in

your experience has been.

841

:

A good way for a friend to

share the news of a pregnancy.

842

:

Yeah.

843

:

I feel like this is such

a hard one because people

844

:

receive things so differently.

845

:

Yeah.

846

:

Um, it might be situational too.

847

:

Yeah.

848

:

And I think so.

849

:

I think for me, like I've always

really appreciated when a friend, like,

850

:

doesn't like shy away from telling me.

851

:

Yeah.

852

:

Um, because I never wanna feel like, you

know, someone can't tell me because of

853

:

like the suffering we're going through.

854

:

That's like almost more painful

than someone just telling me

855

:

and me having to like, you know,

grapple with my own sorrow in that.

856

:

Um, because I feel like it makes, it

just makes you, it just accentuates

857

:

how you are different Yes.

858

:

Than everybody else.

859

:

Yeah.

860

:

When people treat you so much differently.

861

:

Right.

862

:

In some situations it can be hard to

be like, oh, this is awkward 'cause

863

:

like, you had to really feel bad for me.

864

:

Right.

865

:

And think about how am I

gonna tell this person?

866

:

Yes.

867

:

Yeah.

868

:

And like, the reality of like

living a Catholic life is that.

869

:

Like you should be able and like we're

all like broken, so it's not always

870

:

easy, but you should be able to hold

like the joys and sorrows like in tandem.

871

:

Yeah.

872

:

Like that's what the Lord did.

873

:

Yeah.

874

:

That's what Mary did.

875

:

Um, and like I think that's

something that I like, have really

876

:

had to grow in is being like, I

can be really happy for someone.

877

:

Mm-hmm.

878

:

And simultaneously really

sad for like my situation.

879

:

Right.

880

:

Um, and those two things don't like,

need to take precedent over each other.

881

:

Like they can both exist together.

882

:

Yeah.

883

:

Yeah.

884

:

Um, has there been a specific way

that you feel like has been, that

885

:

has like landed well for you?

886

:

Yeah.

887

:

Um, I had one really, like,

really close friend and she just

888

:

has such like a tender heart.

889

:

Yeah.

890

:

Um, and she like texted me and

told me that they were pregnant

891

:

with their like fourth child.

892

:

Mm-hmm.

893

:

Um.

894

:

And I remember being like a little bit

bummed that she texted me about it.

895

:

Mm-hmm.

896

:

Um, but like from her perspective,

she was like, I didn't wanna just

897

:

like blindside you on the phone Yeah.

898

:

By telling me that.

899

:

Yeah.

900

:

And I like really appreciated that.

901

:

Yeah.

902

:

Um, but so I feel like texting

someone and just being like, Hey,

903

:

like, I wanna let you know, I

don't want you to feel left out.

904

:

Mm-hmm.

905

:

Like, this is like, you know mm-hmm.

906

:

We're pregnant again.

907

:

Yeah.

908

:

Yeah.

909

:

And like, giving you space to like,

kind of like process that, um.

910

:

I personally feel like, just

like tell me over the phone.

911

:

I like would rather just like revel in

the joy of you being pregnant than you.

912

:

Like assume that I'm gonna be sad.

913

:

Yeah, yeah.

914

:

Yeah.

915

:

And I think that's where too,

like knowing your friend Yeah.

916

:

Well, is gonna, is gonna come into

play here because if, you know, maybe

917

:

where they're at in this phase of

their journey is a really dark time.

918

:

Yes.

919

:

Yes.

920

:

They might receive it differently.

921

:

Yep.

922

:

Than if they're doing really

well and if they're in a place

923

:

of a lot of hope and joy.

924

:

Yeah.

925

:

And, um, just like grace in their waiting.

926

:

Yeah.

927

:

So I think it's hard 'cause it's like we

can't give you a cookie cutter right way.

928

:

That's like gonna work every time.

929

:

And I just think back to my experience

of friends and family sharing

930

:

the news with me and it's landed

differently at different times.

931

:

Yeah.

932

:

It's so true.

933

:

Yeah.

934

:

You know, like there's been

times where people share with

935

:

me one-on-one and it feels.

936

:

Exciting to know in person when I

saw them, like at a coffee date.

937

:

Right.

938

:

Or there's been times where we've been

shared with one-on-one instead of the

939

:

group, and it's kind of felt like,

oh, did they not feel like they could

940

:

share with us in front of the group?

941

:

Yeah.

942

:

Because of what we're going, you know, so.

943

:

Right.

944

:

I do think it, it kind of depends.

945

:

I think overall, if you.

946

:

If you feel really like nervous about

sharing with a friend, I think writing a

947

:

text or writing a letter is really nice.

948

:

And I had a friend recently

who wrote me a letter.

949

:

Yeah, I love that.

950

:

Um, and she, she brought it to

me and like left, dropped it off

951

:

at my door with some flowers.

952

:

Yeah.

953

:

And just was like.

954

:

Thanking me for our friendship and saying

that she was praying for me on our journey

955

:

and that she wanted to share the news

that they were expecting there first.

956

:

Yeah.

957

:

Um, and that she knew that it could

be hard to hear this news and that

958

:

she wanted me to give me the space to

process and feel whatever emotions that

959

:

I felt like genuinely in that moment.

960

:

Yeah.

961

:

And that she love, you know, to get coffee

to talk about it some, sometimes soon.

962

:

Like yeah, just like catch up.

963

:

That's beautiful.

964

:

And that made me feel really

loved because I'm like, wow.

965

:

Like you thought intentionally enough

to, to think of how I would receive it.

966

:

Right.

967

:

Um, but it was a little bit

more personal than a text.

968

:

Yeah.

969

:

It was like, I'm gonna write you

a letter, bring you some flowers,

970

:

tell you I'm praying for you.

971

:

Yeah.

972

:

Enter the news.

973

:

So I feel like when in

doubt, like that is a super.

974

:

Intentional, thoughtful,

like, safe way to do it.

975

:

Mm-hmm.

976

:

Um, but yeah, I think like knowing

the friend and your relationship

977

:

too is gonna be key here.

978

:

Definitely.

979

:

And I think like when, when you asked

that question Mari, like it made me also

980

:

think about just like how we like as

people who are struggling with this cross.

981

:

Can also like receive people better?

982

:

Yes, because I just heard like,

you know, whenever you like open

983

:

up about this, I feel like you hear

like everyone's stories about it.

984

:

So like I had a friend who, she's

pregnant and she was sharing

985

:

with one of her good friends.

986

:

Um, that they were pregnant again,

and they, her friend had experienced

987

:

like multiple losses in that year.

988

:

Mm.

989

:

And her friend received it really poorly.

990

:

Yeah.

991

:

And she like shared it in person.

992

:

Yeah.

993

:

And she was like, I just didn't feel

like that was the right thing to do.

994

:

I shouldn't have done that.

995

:

You know, all these things.

996

:

And as hard as it is, like I feel

like people in our, she was like,

997

:

all also need to like, actually learn

how to receive people's good news.

998

:

Yeah.

999

:

Like amidst our suffering.

:

00:31:40,437 --> 00:31:40,947

Absolutely.

:

00:31:40,977 --> 00:31:41,127

Um.

:

00:31:41,822 --> 00:31:44,282

Because like, yeah, like I said,

it, like our suffering shouldn't

:

00:31:44,282 --> 00:31:45,872

diminish the joy of someone else.

:

00:31:45,872 --> 00:31:46,377

Like mm-hmm.

:

00:31:46,592 --> 00:31:50,192

I mean, if like one of us was

pregnant, like how stoked would be,

:

00:31:50,192 --> 00:31:50,617

we would be so joyful for each other.

:

00:31:50,647 --> 00:31:51,137

Exactly.

:

00:31:51,302 --> 00:31:55,592

So like, just realizing that like those

two things can exist simultaneously.

:

00:31:55,592 --> 00:31:59,552

So like if someone does share with you

that they're pregnant or whatever mm-hmm.

:

00:31:59,792 --> 00:32:03,482

Um, that you can like, receive them with

joy and not be afraid to like, bring

:

00:32:03,482 --> 00:32:04,742

your suffering to the Lord after that.

:

00:32:04,747 --> 00:32:04,977

Mm-hmm.

:

00:32:05,312 --> 00:32:05,612

Yeah.

:

00:32:05,612 --> 00:32:06,272

It's really important.

:

00:32:06,272 --> 00:32:06,512

Yeah.

:

00:32:06,572 --> 00:32:10,202

And I, I think that is such

a good point too, like it's.

:

00:32:10,587 --> 00:32:15,232

It's very like paradoxical and maybe not

everybody feels this way, but mm-hmm.

:

00:32:15,312 --> 00:32:16,767

It seems like you do and I do as well.

:

00:32:16,767 --> 00:32:16,827

Yeah.

:

00:32:16,827 --> 00:32:21,117

Where like there is a genuine like

excitement that we hold for our friends

:

00:32:21,117 --> 00:32:22,737

and family who are becoming mothers.

:

00:32:22,737 --> 00:32:23,307

Oh my goodness.

:

00:32:23,367 --> 00:32:23,757

Yeah.

:

00:32:23,847 --> 00:32:26,277

And like we are a, like, it's

hard, but like we're able to hold

:

00:32:26,277 --> 00:32:29,457

both and it's not like I'm forcing

myself to be happy for this person.

:

00:32:29,457 --> 00:32:31,047

Like I genuinely am.

:

00:32:31,107 --> 00:32:31,377

Yeah.

:

00:32:31,377 --> 00:32:35,517

And it's so exciting to see my best

friends and my sister-in-laws and

:

00:32:35,517 --> 00:32:37,317

my friends like become mothers.

:

00:32:37,317 --> 00:32:37,887

Absolutely.

:

00:32:37,917 --> 00:32:38,367

Um.

:

00:32:38,472 --> 00:32:42,732

And so I think also like

there's been times where people

:

00:32:42,732 --> 00:32:45,642

expect it to be so hard, right?

:

00:32:45,672 --> 00:32:47,477

That they, they almost

make it shy away from it.

:

00:32:47,482 --> 00:32:47,502

Yeah.

:

00:32:47,502 --> 00:32:49,932

Shy away from it a little bit

where it's like, no, like I want

:

00:32:49,932 --> 00:32:51,642

to share that joy with you as well.

:

00:32:51,642 --> 00:32:51,762

Yeah.

:

00:32:51,822 --> 00:32:52,542

Oh, totally.

:

00:32:52,572 --> 00:32:56,262

But like there may be times where I need

to take, you know, my space as well to

:

00:32:56,262 --> 00:32:58,242

like process, but you can hold both.

:

00:32:58,572 --> 00:32:59,172

Absolutely.

:

00:32:59,172 --> 00:32:59,952

I totally agree.

:

00:33:00,702 --> 00:33:02,622

Okay, next question I have here.

:

00:33:03,102 --> 00:33:06,042

What is something that a friend

did for you that made you feel

:

00:33:06,102 --> 00:33:08,112

deeply seen in your suffering?

:

00:33:08,112 --> 00:33:08,202

Hmm.

:

00:33:08,785 --> 00:33:09,895

That's a really hard question.

:

00:33:12,505 --> 00:33:15,925

I feel like I'm gonna answer this like in

like, specifically with pregnancy loss.

:

00:33:15,985 --> 00:33:16,495

Yeah.

:

00:33:16,615 --> 00:33:17,875

Um, totally go for it.

:

00:33:18,195 --> 00:33:21,705

So I think for me, something that's

made me feel deeply seen, like amid

:

00:33:21,705 --> 00:33:26,355

my suffering is I have one friend who

she's like, asked us the name, like

:

00:33:26,355 --> 00:33:28,125

if we named our babies that we lost.

:

00:33:28,155 --> 00:33:28,245

Mm-hmm.

:

00:33:28,485 --> 00:33:29,505

And we have named them.

:

00:33:30,010 --> 00:33:33,430

And so she'll like often like just reach

out to us and be like, Hey, like I'm just

:

00:33:33,430 --> 00:33:37,300

thinking of you guys and like, you know,

ask your baby to interview for us today.

:

00:33:37,750 --> 00:33:37,780

Aw.

:

00:33:37,780 --> 00:33:38,920

Which is super beautiful.

:

00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:42,130

She also like, knows the days that

they were supposed to be born.

:

00:33:42,460 --> 00:33:45,550

Um, and so she'll like even like,

say something on that day, which I

:

00:33:45,550 --> 00:33:47,260

feel like makes us feel very seen.

:

00:33:47,770 --> 00:33:50,650

Um, 'cause yeah, that can be just

like something that's like very

:

00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:54,880

isolating when you that like day

comes and like no one knows about it.

:

00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:56,320

Yeah, totally.

:

00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:58,960

Um, so I think those two things have made

me feel like really loved, really seen.

:

00:33:59,890 --> 00:34:00,970

That is so beautiful.

:

00:34:01,090 --> 00:34:01,150

Yeah.

:

00:34:01,210 --> 00:34:01,870

I love that.

:

00:34:01,900 --> 00:34:02,260

Yeah.

:

00:34:02,710 --> 00:34:09,070

I think for me, um, is the past

two years there's been different

:

00:34:09,070 --> 00:34:13,060

friends that have just sent me a

little something on Mother's Day.

:

00:34:13,510 --> 00:34:13,719

I love that.

:

00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:14,080

Yeah.

:

00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:16,449

And it's been very unexpected both times.

:

00:34:16,449 --> 00:34:16,510

Yeah.

:

00:34:16,510 --> 00:34:21,370

And I think Mother's Day, I mean,

there's been mixed emotions on it.

:

00:34:21,375 --> 00:34:21,514

Mm-hmm.

:

00:34:21,594 --> 00:34:25,060

And we can kind of like tie this into

this part of the conversation as well.

:

00:34:25,060 --> 00:34:25,120

Yeah.

:

00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:26,050

If you have any thoughts on it.

:

00:34:26,380 --> 00:34:27,850

Um, whereas like.

:

00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:32,110

It's like the days leading up, I'm like

almost like kind of dreading it to come.

:

00:34:32,139 --> 00:34:35,889

'cause I'm like, oh man, I just like

hope this day's not gonna be like so sad

:

00:34:35,889 --> 00:34:38,110

and just like, just a bummer all day.

:

00:34:38,409 --> 00:34:38,560

Mm-hmm.

:

00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:41,110

Um, I mean like I genuinely wanna

celebrate my mom too, right?

:

00:34:41,290 --> 00:34:41,350

Yeah.

:

00:34:41,380 --> 00:34:44,260

But then it's also like I hold

sadness for myself as well.

:

00:34:44,260 --> 00:34:44,770

Yeah, totally.

:

00:34:44,860 --> 00:34:45,489

Um.

:

00:34:46,210 --> 00:34:48,639

And it's just like little things

that have unexpectedly come

:

00:34:48,639 --> 00:34:49,659

to like, brighten that day.

:

00:34:49,659 --> 00:34:49,719

Yeah.

:

00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:51,940

That has made it feel just

like a little bit lighter.

:

00:34:52,179 --> 00:34:56,920

And so like a couple years ago, a

friend sent me a card with a beautiful

:

00:34:56,920 --> 00:35:01,660

prayer card with the mag, um, yeah,

the mag uh, the memorare on it memo

:

00:35:01,660 --> 00:35:03,041

the Memorare and, oh, wait, no.

:

00:35:03,046 --> 00:35:04,180

Was it meant the magnifica?

:

00:35:04,240 --> 00:35:06,550

Maybe it was a magnifica feel like the

magnification makes more sense, but yeah.

:

00:35:06,550 --> 00:35:06,640

Yes.

:

00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:08,470

I think it was, you're right,

it was a magnification.

:

00:35:08,710 --> 00:35:11,680

Um, and she just like sent me like,

again, like a handwritten letter.

:

00:35:11,695 --> 00:35:13,645

Really beautiful with

a little prayer card.

:

00:35:14,215 --> 00:35:14,425

I love that.

:

00:35:14,425 --> 00:35:15,535

To kinda lift my spirits.

:

00:35:15,655 --> 00:35:15,715

Yeah.

:

00:35:15,715 --> 00:35:20,335

And then this past year, um, these,

this little bouquet here on the

:

00:35:20,335 --> 00:35:23,905

table, our neighbor Kim, I just

like opened the door to like, go,

:

00:35:23,905 --> 00:35:25,435

we went to the zoo on Mother's Day.

:

00:35:25,435 --> 00:35:25,495

Yeah.

:

00:35:25,735 --> 00:35:29,005

And I opened the door and there was a

card with this beautiful little bouquet.

:

00:35:29,035 --> 00:35:30,055

That is so sweet.

:

00:35:30,060 --> 00:35:30,480

Oh my goodness.

:

00:35:30,790 --> 00:35:31,080

Yeah.

:

00:35:31,140 --> 00:35:32,605

And I was just like, what?

:

00:35:32,605 --> 00:35:35,665

Like, it just, like, it

literally put a smile on my face.

:

00:35:35,815 --> 00:35:35,875

Yeah.

:

00:35:36,415 --> 00:35:38,455

And made me feel so seen.

:

00:35:38,785 --> 00:35:39,145

And.

:

00:35:39,835 --> 00:35:43,885

It's not to take away the

joy or importance of Mother's

:

00:35:43,885 --> 00:35:44,845

Day for other people.

:

00:35:44,845 --> 00:35:44,935

Right.

:

00:35:44,965 --> 00:35:45,230

You know?

:

00:35:45,230 --> 00:35:45,510

Mm-hmm.

:

00:35:45,595 --> 00:35:47,995

Like, I'm not on the train where

like, like, you know, you get

:

00:35:47,995 --> 00:35:50,125

like so many emails in your inbox

this year of just like, if this

:

00:35:50,125 --> 00:35:52,045

day's hard for you, we understand.

:

00:35:52,585 --> 00:35:53,695

Have you gotten those like emails?

:

00:35:53,725 --> 00:35:53,995

No.

:

00:35:54,355 --> 00:35:54,535

Oh.

:

00:35:54,535 --> 00:35:56,095

Like, like marketing emails.

:

00:35:56,545 --> 00:35:56,965

You haven't really?

:

00:35:57,265 --> 00:35:57,655

Oh yeah.

:

00:35:57,655 --> 00:36:00,535

Brands will like send out an email

now, like a couple days in advance of

:

00:36:00,535 --> 00:36:04,045

like, if you don't wanna see Mother's

Day emails or Mother's Day content.

:

00:36:04,045 --> 00:36:05,815

Like off Mother's Day a little bit.

:

00:36:05,905 --> 00:36:06,445

Yeah.

:

00:36:06,445 --> 00:36:10,075

Or just basically just like the culture

today I feel like is so like you need

:

00:36:10,075 --> 00:36:12,325

to, you need to have so many disclaimers.

:

00:36:12,475 --> 00:36:12,715

Yeah.

:

00:36:12,775 --> 00:36:15,655

Of like, we're celebrating mother's,

but also like if you a trigger warning.

:

00:36:15,805 --> 00:36:16,075

Yes.

:

00:36:16,075 --> 00:36:17,155

Like it's like a trigger warning.

:

00:36:17,750 --> 00:36:20,930

Like, I'm not on that train where it's

like, you can't like be joyful on this day

:

00:36:20,930 --> 00:36:24,890

or like celebrate moms, but it just, it

makes you feel really seen when somebody

:

00:36:24,890 --> 00:36:27,500

acknowledges like, Hey, this might be kind

of a hard day for you because Totally.

:

00:36:27,500 --> 00:36:27,650

Yeah.

:

00:36:27,650 --> 00:36:29,660

You've been trying to be a

mom for like three years.

:

00:36:29,660 --> 00:36:33,110

You have this desire to be a mom

and it's just a reminder on this

:

00:36:33,110 --> 00:36:34,490

day that like you're not yet.

:

00:36:34,670 --> 00:36:35,150

Yeah.

:

00:36:35,150 --> 00:36:37,430

Um, for somebody who hasn't, you

know, absolutely been pregnant before.

:

00:36:37,430 --> 00:36:37,490

Yeah.

:

00:36:37,730 --> 00:36:41,420

So that was just like a sweet

little sweet little surprise on my

:

00:36:41,420 --> 00:36:42,890

doorstep that I think was so sweet.

:

00:36:42,980 --> 00:36:43,520

Oh my gosh.

:

00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:43,790

I feel that's.

:

00:36:44,965 --> 00:36:51,805

Literally, this was the sweetest thing on

Mother's Day this year at:

:

00:36:52,105 --> 00:36:56,995

We're in bed about to go to bed, and then

Bodhi, our dog, barks like protectively

:

00:36:56,995 --> 00:36:58,945

from downstairs and I'm like, huh?

:

00:36:58,975 --> 00:37:01,735

Someone must be like

at the door something.

:

00:37:01,735 --> 00:37:01,795

Yeah.

:

00:37:01,795 --> 00:37:04,375

Like he only does that when there's

like a car pulling up or at the door.

:

00:37:04,615 --> 00:37:06,355

So Trey goes down there to check it out.

:

00:37:07,105 --> 00:37:10,105

And there's an Instacart lady, and

he text me before opening the door.

:

00:37:10,105 --> 00:37:11,215

He goes, did you order food?

:

00:37:11,515 --> 00:37:12,505

And I was like, no.

:

00:37:12,715 --> 00:37:13,430

And he's like, at 10 o'clock?

:

00:37:13,500 --> 00:37:14,335

Yeah, at 10 o'clock.

:

00:37:14,335 --> 00:37:16,255

And he's like, uh, okay,

I'm gonna check it out.

:

00:37:16,495 --> 00:37:18,505

He opens the door and there's

a lady holding a bouquet of

:

00:37:18,505 --> 00:37:21,205

flowers and he was like, hi.

:

00:37:21,655 --> 00:37:26,125

And she goes from Julie and

Sam, and he was like, what?

:

00:37:26,500 --> 00:37:28,960

And my siblings names Aw are who?

:

00:37:29,560 --> 00:37:30,250

And Sam.

:

00:37:30,340 --> 00:37:31,540

Oh, that's so sweet.

:

00:37:31,540 --> 00:37:33,220

And she goes, that's all I know.

:

00:37:33,670 --> 00:37:37,420

She hands him the bouquet and he comes

upstairs and I text my siblings and

:

00:37:37,420 --> 00:37:40,870

they literally sent me a bouquet of

flowers that night I would cry with.

:

00:37:40,870 --> 00:37:43,180

I did cry with a little texting.

:

00:37:43,570 --> 00:37:48,010

Um, as the eldest daughter, like you

basically, you basically were our

:

00:37:48,010 --> 00:37:51,910

second mom and also raised us like,

wanted to brighten your day to day.

:

00:37:51,940 --> 00:37:53,275

And I was like, oh my gosh, what?

:

00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:55,190

Inside is the sweetest thing in the world.

:

00:37:55,190 --> 00:38:00,590

It literally made me cry because

my sister's 21 and my brother's 16.

:

00:38:00,650 --> 00:38:01,100

Yeah.

:

00:38:01,100 --> 00:38:03,740

And this little gesture just showed

like they're getting older and

:

00:38:03,740 --> 00:38:05,390

maturing and I'm like, you can't.

:

00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:07,750

You can't be doing that right now.

:

00:38:07,750 --> 00:38:07,810

Yeah.

:

00:38:08,140 --> 00:38:09,010

But thank you.

:

00:38:09,370 --> 00:38:09,820

Yeah.

:

00:38:09,850 --> 00:38:11,020

So little things like that.

:

00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:12,430

I love that so much.

:

00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:13,390

Yeah.

:

00:38:13,390 --> 00:38:17,890

I feel like Mother's Day has brought

a lot of mixed emotions for me.

:

00:38:17,950 --> 00:38:18,220

Yeah.

:

00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:19,360

Um, how has that been for you?

:

00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:19,840

Yeah.

:

00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:22,000

I think like, well, our

first year of marriage, I.

:

00:38:22,155 --> 00:38:24,525

Like we had already experienced one loss.

:

00:38:24,555 --> 00:38:24,585

Mm.

:

00:38:25,185 --> 00:38:28,545

And then this year, like

experiencing two losses now.

:

00:38:28,550 --> 00:38:28,760

Mm-hmm.

:

00:38:29,145 --> 00:38:31,755

And like, you know, like you

said, like I am a mother.

:

00:38:31,785 --> 00:38:34,845

It feels very different than

like a mom who has like three

:

00:38:34,845 --> 00:38:36,195

children or five children in flesh.

:

00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:36,360

Yeah.

:

00:38:36,380 --> 00:38:36,640

You know?

:

00:38:36,645 --> 00:38:36,915

Yeah.

:

00:38:36,915 --> 00:38:37,425

Absolutely.

:

00:38:37,515 --> 00:38:41,415

Um, and so like, I think my biggest

thing on Mother's Day that I

:

00:38:41,415 --> 00:38:45,345

just like dread is when they make

all the moms stand up at mass.

:

00:38:45,375 --> 00:38:45,645

Yep.

:

00:38:45,645 --> 00:38:46,605

And wanna pray for them.

:

00:38:46,635 --> 00:38:46,905

Yep.

:

00:38:47,215 --> 00:38:48,655

I literally had it in my head.

:

00:38:48,655 --> 00:38:51,685

I was like, I need to tell Tanner

ahead of time that I'm not standing

:

00:38:51,685 --> 00:38:53,815

up and don't try to make me stand up.

:

00:38:53,815 --> 00:38:54,325

Mm-hmm.

:

00:38:54,331 --> 00:38:56,215

Because like, you know, it

comes from a good place for him.

:

00:38:56,215 --> 00:38:56,995

He's like, you're a mom.

:

00:38:56,995 --> 00:38:59,695

Like, I want you to be able to

like, be like, you know, seen.

:

00:38:59,695 --> 00:39:01,825

And I'm like, I don't

wanna be seen right now.

:

00:39:01,825 --> 00:39:02,155

Yeah.

:

00:39:02,575 --> 00:39:03,265

Um.

:

00:39:03,470 --> 00:39:05,480

And like, that might be different for

different people, but for me sure.

:

00:39:05,660 --> 00:39:06,890

I'm like, yeah.

:

00:39:06,890 --> 00:39:09,830

Like it just like begs a lot of

questions from people and like being

:

00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:12,380

a parish missionary in a new place,

like where everybody knows you don't

:

00:39:12,380 --> 00:39:15,980

need every single person asking me

if I'm pregnant after mass, you know?

:

00:39:16,190 --> 00:39:16,995

Oh yeah, for sure.

:

00:39:17,065 --> 00:39:17,355

Yeah.

:

00:39:17,570 --> 00:39:20,030

Um, or just like, even like being

like, oh, like are you a mom?

:

00:39:20,060 --> 00:39:22,130

Like, you know, like all the

questions that would come with that.

:

00:39:22,130 --> 00:39:24,770

So Totally for me, like that's

something that's really hard for me.

:

00:39:25,255 --> 00:39:28,705

Um, but also similar to you, I

can't believe how many people like

:

00:39:28,705 --> 00:39:31,135

unexpectedly reached out to me on Sunday.

:

00:39:31,195 --> 00:39:31,405

Mm-hmm.

:

00:39:31,645 --> 00:39:33,085

Like, I was just like so blown away.

:

00:39:33,115 --> 00:39:34,585

Like, just You don't expect that?

:

00:39:34,585 --> 00:39:34,645

No.

:

00:39:35,035 --> 00:39:35,335

Yeah.

:

00:39:35,335 --> 00:39:38,155

Old students, like friends from

where I used to live before this,

:

00:39:38,215 --> 00:39:40,195

um, and like, it's just like.

:

00:39:40,250 --> 00:39:43,130

Even just that little gesture of

just being like, Hey, I see you today

:

00:39:43,190 --> 00:39:45,590

and like you probably like, you're

not gonna get that from a lot of

:

00:39:45,590 --> 00:39:46,815

other people, but like, I see you.

:

00:39:46,885 --> 00:39:47,175

Yeah.

:

00:39:47,330 --> 00:39:49,730

Like some friends even were like, I

don't really feel like it's right to

:

00:39:49,730 --> 00:39:51,500

be like Happy Mother's Day to you.

:

00:39:51,505 --> 00:39:51,655

Mm-hmm.

:

00:39:51,735 --> 00:39:53,000

But like, know that I'm praying for you.

:

00:39:53,060 --> 00:39:53,390

Yeah.

:

00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:54,560

I'm like really moved by that.

:

00:39:54,620 --> 00:39:55,070

Yeah.

:

00:39:55,100 --> 00:39:58,370

You know, I even, this is so

crazy, but there's one person I

:

00:39:58,370 --> 00:40:00,170

parish I've literally met one time.

:

00:40:00,545 --> 00:40:03,515

She emailed me after Mass and

was like, I saw you at Mass and

:

00:40:03,515 --> 00:40:05,645

I want, you know, 'cause like

she's heard my story a little bit.

:

00:40:05,915 --> 00:40:05,945

Oh.

:

00:40:05,975 --> 00:40:07,955

She's like, I want you to know that

I'm praying for you today, and I know

:

00:40:07,955 --> 00:40:09,095

it's probably a hard day for you.

:

00:40:09,095 --> 00:40:09,155

Wow.

:

00:40:10,505 --> 00:40:12,965

The fact that you went outta

your to email me to email.

:

00:40:12,965 --> 00:40:13,775

I know.

:

00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:14,060

Wow.

:

00:40:14,060 --> 00:40:16,145

And she like, probably has no idea

how like much that meant to me.

:

00:40:16,205 --> 00:40:16,475

Yeah.

:

00:40:16,805 --> 00:40:17,555

That's so sweet.

:

00:40:17,615 --> 00:40:18,545

That's huge.

:

00:40:18,755 --> 00:40:22,595

Um, I also like on Mother's Day,

like if you have friends, like

:

00:40:22,625 --> 00:40:24,905

if we have friends that are also

struggling through this, like.

:

00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:26,210

Mari texted me in the morning.

:

00:40:26,215 --> 00:40:26,325

Mm-hmm.

:

00:40:26,405 --> 00:40:27,800

And it's so funny 'cause like

I've been thinking about her

:

00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:28,760

and Trey all morning too.

:

00:40:29,300 --> 00:40:29,510

Yeah.

:

00:40:29,510 --> 00:40:32,330

Um, but I always text too, like

my campus minister who's been like

:

00:40:32,330 --> 00:40:34,700

struggling with infertility for like

their entire marriage and they've

:

00:40:34,700 --> 00:40:36,050

been married for a very long time.

:

00:40:36,620 --> 00:40:38,600

I always reach out to her on

Mother's Day and I'm like,

:

00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:40,460

Hey, like you are a mom to me.

:

00:40:40,730 --> 00:40:40,760

Mm.

:

00:40:40,760 --> 00:40:42,170

And like I know how much like.

:

00:40:42,685 --> 00:40:44,905

You spiritually mother,

like everyone in your life.

:

00:40:44,905 --> 00:40:44,965

Yeah.

:

00:40:44,965 --> 00:40:45,985

And like there stays for you too.

:

00:40:46,045 --> 00:40:46,105

Yeah.

:

00:40:46,285 --> 00:40:48,595

And so like, just like trying to

recognize other people in their

:

00:40:48,595 --> 00:40:50,515

like longing for motherhood Yeah.

:

00:40:50,515 --> 00:40:51,265

Is so beautiful.

:

00:40:51,325 --> 00:40:51,505

Yeah.

:

00:40:51,505 --> 00:40:53,245

So it's a hard day, but

it's also a good day.

:

00:40:53,305 --> 00:40:54,026

Yeah, yeah.

:

00:40:54,085 --> 00:40:54,385

Yeah.

:

00:40:54,385 --> 00:40:55,255

I think, yeah.

:

00:40:55,255 --> 00:40:57,745

Those little acknowledgements like

that, like you reaching out to her and

:

00:40:57,745 --> 00:40:59,395

being like, you're a mom to me Yeah.

:

00:40:59,545 --> 00:41:02,455

Is different than, you know,

someone saying to you like.

:

00:41:02,455 --> 00:41:05,430

Happy Mother's Day and you kind of having

to kind of wrestle with like, am I a mom?

:

00:41:05,430 --> 00:41:06,000

Am I not?

:

00:41:06,150 --> 00:41:06,240

Right?

:

00:41:06,240 --> 00:41:06,360

Yeah.

:

00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:07,020

I think, yeah.

:

00:41:07,020 --> 00:41:08,970

For me, I had a little moment like that.

:

00:41:09,030 --> 00:41:09,450

Yeah.

:

00:41:09,450 --> 00:41:11,070

We, we went to the zoo for Mother's Day.

:

00:41:11,070 --> 00:41:11,490

I love that.

:

00:41:11,490 --> 00:41:12,236

With our family that Yeah.

:

00:41:12,695 --> 00:41:15,510

And I honestly, I honestly had

a great Mother's Day this year.

:

00:41:15,870 --> 00:41:15,960

Yeah.

:

00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:16,981

I think, like I love

going to the zoo, right.

:

00:41:16,986 --> 00:41:17,580

It makes me happy.

:

00:41:17,580 --> 00:41:21,330

So I'm actually so glad we did that

instead of me sitting at home just like.

:

00:41:21,505 --> 00:41:22,075

Moping.

:

00:41:22,075 --> 00:41:22,405

Sad.

:

00:41:22,435 --> 00:41:22,555

Yeah.

:

00:41:22,555 --> 00:41:23,425

By myself, right.

:

00:41:23,815 --> 00:41:28,735

Um, so I had a great time and

my little niece, she too, and my

:

00:41:28,735 --> 00:41:30,115

sister-in-law was trying to teach her.

:

00:41:30,115 --> 00:41:32,815

She's like, you know,

Mari's your godmother.

:

00:41:32,815 --> 00:41:35,820

And she's like, you can say like, happy

mother's Aid, your godmother, you know?

:

00:41:35,820 --> 00:41:36,220

That's so sweet.

:

00:41:36,225 --> 00:41:37,795

She's your spiritual mom.

:

00:41:37,795 --> 00:41:39,415

And that's just something

I didn't think about.

:

00:41:39,415 --> 00:41:39,685

Yeah.

:

00:41:39,685 --> 00:41:40,420

You know, I was like, oh, that's.

:

00:41:40,660 --> 00:41:40,780

Sweet.

:

00:41:40,780 --> 00:41:40,870

Right.

:

00:41:41,425 --> 00:41:43,690

And she like brought me a little

souvenir 'cause she was traveling

:

00:41:43,690 --> 00:41:45,670

abroad and she like brought me

a little soup, well not abroad.

:

00:41:45,670 --> 00:41:46,540

That sounded like she was in Europe.

:

00:41:46,540 --> 00:41:49,330

She was in Canada, she was in

Europe, she was in traveling Europe.

:

00:41:49,330 --> 00:41:50,890

It's just not, not that

far, but it's 2-year-old.

:

00:41:50,890 --> 00:41:51,730

She was in Canada.

:

00:41:52,090 --> 00:41:54,580

Um, and she brought me a little

thing and she was like, it's

:

00:41:54,580 --> 00:41:55,870

just like a Godmother gift.

:

00:41:55,870 --> 00:41:57,820

And I was like, that's

just so intentional.

:

00:41:57,820 --> 00:41:59,020

Like that's just so sweet.

:

00:41:59,025 --> 00:41:59,035

Yeah.

:

00:41:59,110 --> 00:41:59,710

That's beautiful.

:

00:41:59,710 --> 00:42:00,160

Yeah.

:

00:42:00,250 --> 00:42:00,610

Yeah.

:

00:42:00,610 --> 00:42:03,340

There's definitely ways you can like

make people feel seen on Mother's Day.

:

00:42:03,340 --> 00:42:03,430

Mm-hmm.

:

00:42:03,670 --> 00:42:04,990

Especially when they're

like longing for it.

:

00:42:04,990 --> 00:42:05,080

Mm-hmm.

:

00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:05,590

You know?

:

00:42:05,690 --> 00:42:07,550

-:

one thing you said earlier too that I

:

00:42:07,550 --> 00:42:12,470

kind of wanna come back to and then add

on to is, um, a lot of the times people.

:

00:42:13,430 --> 00:42:15,980

They want to say something, they

just don't know what to say.

:

00:42:16,130 --> 00:42:20,630

And sometimes the fear of saying

something wrong stops people

:

00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:22,460

from saying anything at all.

:

00:42:22,460 --> 00:42:22,820

Yeah.

:

00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:28,460

Um, and I kind of just wanna ask and

kind of go into another conversation

:

00:42:28,460 --> 00:42:33,650

about like how just even being

present with that person mm-hmm.

:

00:42:33,950 --> 00:42:35,540

Can be enough sometimes.

:

00:42:35,570 --> 00:42:35,810

Yeah.

:

00:42:35,910 --> 00:42:40,410

And just like trying to offer

consolation and love over trying to

:

00:42:40,410 --> 00:42:44,340

figure out like what would be the

best thing to make them feel better,

:

00:42:44,340 --> 00:42:48,390

like to solve their problem or to

specifically speak into what they shared.

:

00:42:48,600 --> 00:42:52,530

Like something, sometimes even

just having, sometimes even just

:

00:42:52,530 --> 00:42:54,360

sharing like a generic like.

:

00:42:55,020 --> 00:42:59,610

Words of affirmation or words of love,

or words of encouragement, like, yeah.

:

00:42:59,700 --> 00:43:02,910

Even if it is generic and you feel

like, oh, that was so stupid, I

:

00:43:02,910 --> 00:43:03,900

shouldn't have said anything at all.

:

00:43:04,075 --> 00:43:07,770

Like that goes more, I think, sometimes

than just not saying anything at all.

:

00:43:07,770 --> 00:43:08,340

Oh, for sure.

:

00:43:08,430 --> 00:43:12,510

And then just like being present with the

person in their struggle and not always

:

00:43:12,510 --> 00:43:15,990

having to figure out like, how am I going

to respond to what they share with me?

:

00:43:15,990 --> 00:43:16,050

Yeah.

:

00:43:16,200 --> 00:43:19,530

And what do I say every time they

say something can go a long way.

:

00:43:19,590 --> 00:43:19,680

Mm-hmm.

:

00:43:19,920 --> 00:43:22,410

So what do you feel like it

looks like to just be present

:

00:43:22,410 --> 00:43:23,700

to a friend on this journey?

:

00:43:23,700 --> 00:43:23,730

I.

:

00:43:24,195 --> 00:43:27,225

Yeah, I think, like I said this

at the beginning, like one of

:

00:43:27,225 --> 00:43:30,675

the hardest things is feeling

like alone and feeling isolated.

:

00:43:30,675 --> 00:43:34,665

And so when like your close friends

or family like are like not saying

:

00:43:34,665 --> 00:43:37,845

something out of fear of like hurting

your feelings or not saying the right

:

00:43:37,845 --> 00:43:41,115

thing that like makes you feel more

isolated, it makes you feel more lonely.

:

00:43:41,505 --> 00:43:45,165

So I think like, just like when MA's

saying, like, just saying something, um,

:

00:43:45,165 --> 00:43:48,705

like I've had a couple of friends and

family members who've just been like.

:

00:43:49,215 --> 00:43:51,435

I don't feel like there's

anything I can say right now.

:

00:43:51,495 --> 00:43:51,555

Yeah.

:

00:43:51,555 --> 00:43:53,805

That would make this

better because it's so sad.

:

00:43:53,865 --> 00:43:53,925

Yeah.

:

00:43:54,015 --> 00:43:58,455

You know, and even them just saying

that like, affirms how I feel.

:

00:43:58,485 --> 00:43:58,725

Yes.

:

00:43:58,725 --> 00:44:01,875

You know, so even just being

like, there's nothing I could

:

00:44:01,875 --> 00:44:03,465

say to make this better for you.

:

00:44:03,470 --> 00:44:03,610

Mm-hmm.

:

00:44:03,690 --> 00:44:04,905

And I'm really sorry about that.

:

00:44:04,905 --> 00:44:04,906

Mm-hmm.

:

00:44:05,325 --> 00:44:06,705

Like that like is affirming.

:

00:44:06,855 --> 00:44:07,185

Mm-hmm.

:

00:44:07,245 --> 00:44:08,565

You know, you're like, okay, totally.

:

00:44:08,625 --> 00:44:11,175

I feel seen in this like,

struggle that I'm feeling.

:

00:44:11,565 --> 00:44:13,965

Um, but also just like not being afraid.

:

00:44:14,155 --> 00:44:15,385

Of saying the wrong thing.

:

00:44:15,415 --> 00:44:17,065

'cause like to someone you love, right?

:

00:44:17,065 --> 00:44:20,065

Like most people will be able to be

like, Hey, that like actually kinda

:

00:44:20,065 --> 00:44:21,325

hurt my feelings when you said that.

:

00:44:21,330 --> 00:44:21,660

Mm-hmm.

:

00:44:21,740 --> 00:44:24,505

You know, had many a conversation

with my little sister being like,

:

00:44:24,925 --> 00:44:27,835

Hey, actually, like when you say

that, this is how it makes me feel.

:

00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:28,020

Mm-hmm.

:

00:44:28,105 --> 00:44:29,485

And then she was like, oh my gosh.

:

00:44:29,575 --> 00:44:29,785

Yeah.

:

00:44:29,785 --> 00:44:32,245

Like, I didn't even think that

would make you feel that way.

:

00:44:32,465 --> 00:44:33,995

And then I think that just.

:

00:44:34,805 --> 00:44:38,255

Like being present with somebody

in their suffering, like

:

00:44:38,255 --> 00:44:39,815

can mean like a lot to them.

:

00:44:39,820 --> 00:44:39,920

Yeah.

:

00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:40,080

Right.

:

00:44:40,205 --> 00:44:42,725

And like, I know I have a lot of

friends who like immediately will

:

00:44:42,725 --> 00:44:45,425

be like, oh, well have you tried

this or this or this or this, or My

:

00:44:45,425 --> 00:44:47,045

friend did this, you should try this.

:

00:44:47,135 --> 00:44:47,315

Yeah.

:

00:44:47,375 --> 00:44:50,825

Um, when sometimes we just like

want to be like, listened to.

:

00:44:50,825 --> 00:44:51,275

Mm-hmm.

:

00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:54,360

Um, and like, we don't need like

all the solutions right now.

:

00:44:54,360 --> 00:44:54,640

Mm-hmm.

:

00:44:54,720 --> 00:44:56,705

Sometimes the solutions

can be overwhelming.

:

00:44:56,765 --> 00:44:56,840

Oh, for sure.

:

00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:58,535

And I think for I that you

brought that up 'cause that's,

:

00:44:58,595 --> 00:44:59,735

that's what I was gonna say too.

:

00:44:59,735 --> 00:44:59,795

Yeah.

:

00:44:59,795 --> 00:45:03,035

About like being present with them

and where they're at in their journey.

:

00:45:03,245 --> 00:45:03,335

Yes.

:

00:45:03,335 --> 00:45:03,455

Yeah.

:

00:45:03,455 --> 00:45:03,725

And.

:

00:45:04,370 --> 00:45:06,350

And sometimes that's more

helpful than trying to be the

:

00:45:06,350 --> 00:45:07,670

one to help to like look ahead.

:

00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:08,060

Right.

:

00:45:08,120 --> 00:45:11,540

Um, 'cause yeah, I, and again, it probably

comes from a very well-meaning place.

:

00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:14,420

Mm-hmm And I think I experienced

this a lot on social media too.

:

00:45:14,420 --> 00:45:18,170

I think part of the reason why I don't

share as much as I feel like some people

:

00:45:18,170 --> 00:45:20,960

want me to, 'cause there are other

women going through this and as much as

:

00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:22,760

I want to like uplift, encourage them.

:

00:45:22,765 --> 00:45:22,825

Yeah.

:

00:45:23,210 --> 00:45:27,740

The hard part is whenever I do

share, I get a slew of dms of people

:

00:45:27,740 --> 00:45:30,020

being like, oh, like my friend did

this and this and this and this

:

00:45:30,020 --> 00:45:31,070

and this and have you tried this?

:

00:45:31,070 --> 00:45:31,640

And Yeah.

:

00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:32,240

Um.

:

00:45:32,475 --> 00:45:36,105

Yeah, it's hard to hear sometimes

'cause one, the person you're talking

:

00:45:36,105 --> 00:45:38,175

to may have tried all those things.

:

00:45:38,175 --> 00:45:38,265

Right?

:

00:45:38,355 --> 00:45:41,865

And so it's almost like pointing out like,

oh, look at all the things that they're,

:

00:45:41,985 --> 00:45:45,885

that you could do and didn't work for

them and it didn't work for them, right?

:

00:45:45,915 --> 00:45:46,065

Yeah.

:

00:45:46,095 --> 00:45:47,685

So I think that knowing somebody's.

:

00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:51,245

Um, without knowing somebody's

like journey mm-hmm.

:

00:45:51,325 --> 00:45:53,570

And them like inviting you into

that, in that conversation.

:

00:45:53,570 --> 00:45:57,080

I feel like being present looks

like listening to them where they're

:

00:45:57,080 --> 00:45:58,165

at and encouraging them Yeah.

:

00:45:58,170 --> 00:45:59,600

Where they're at in their journey.

:

00:45:59,660 --> 00:46:00,020

Right.

:

00:46:00,020 --> 00:46:03,650

And not really like pushing towards the

future again, like, oh, like adoption

:

00:46:03,650 --> 00:46:07,250

or all these other medical things that

you could do or This helps so and so.

:

00:46:07,370 --> 00:46:07,550

Yeah.

:

00:46:07,580 --> 00:46:10,010

Um, 'cause you never know what's

everybody's different and you never

:

00:46:10,010 --> 00:46:14,270

know what's gonna be the thing that,

you know, helps you necessarily.

:

00:46:14,270 --> 00:46:14,330

Yeah.

:

00:46:14,720 --> 00:46:15,440

Um.

:

00:46:15,950 --> 00:46:20,870

The other thing too that I thought

of is if you have a friend that has

:

00:46:20,870 --> 00:46:25,130

opened up to you about like what their

journey actually looks like, their

:

00:46:25,130 --> 00:46:27,230

medical history and procedures mm-hmm.

:

00:46:27,470 --> 00:46:31,220

And testing and all that kind of stuff,

treatments that they're doing, if they've

:

00:46:31,220 --> 00:46:34,715

opened up to you about that, like being

present with them in that journey.

:

00:46:34,715 --> 00:46:34,725

Mm-hmm.

:

00:46:34,940 --> 00:46:37,310

And offering prayers, like if,

you know, like, oh, they have

:

00:46:37,310 --> 00:46:38,510

a surgery date on this day.

:

00:46:38,510 --> 00:46:38,570

Yeah.

:

00:46:38,570 --> 00:46:41,570

Like offering prayers of like

him praying for you today.

:

00:46:41,570 --> 00:46:41,870

Mm-hmm.

:

00:46:42,075 --> 00:46:45,875

Like, let me know if you need anything

after or offering to bring a meal even

:

00:46:45,875 --> 00:46:49,265

like after they have a procedure done

or something like that could be helpful.

:

00:46:49,355 --> 00:46:50,435

Yeah, absolutely.

:

00:46:50,435 --> 00:46:51,760

And like checking in on them mm-hmm.

:

00:46:51,840 --> 00:46:53,135

If they are sharing those things with you.

:

00:46:53,135 --> 00:46:53,525

Mm-hmm.

:

00:46:53,825 --> 00:46:54,635

I think is like a really.

:

00:46:54,835 --> 00:46:56,515

It makes you feel seen by them.

:

00:46:56,605 --> 00:46:56,695

Mm-hmm.

:

00:46:56,935 --> 00:46:59,965

I, we, I, we had a friend, our neighbor,

our other neighbor actually like, brought

:

00:46:59,965 --> 00:47:02,215

us a meal recently after we had a surgery.

:

00:47:02,485 --> 00:47:05,245

Um, and like, yeah, that just like, you

know, it might not seem like that big

:

00:47:05,245 --> 00:47:07,015

of a deal, but like it is a big deal.

:

00:47:07,075 --> 00:47:07,195

Yeah.

:

00:47:07,195 --> 00:47:08,005

If someone does that for you.

:

00:47:08,005 --> 00:47:08,155

Yeah.

:

00:47:08,305 --> 00:47:08,695

So.

:

00:47:09,430 --> 00:47:11,740

Aw, Allie, thanks for

sharing everything today.

:

00:47:11,740 --> 00:47:12,335

This is so cool in your heart.

:

00:47:12,520 --> 00:47:12,700

Yeah.

:

00:47:12,700 --> 00:47:15,460

Is there anything else that you like,

feel like is on your heart that you

:

00:47:15,460 --> 00:47:18,010

wanna leave, um, our listeners with?

:

00:47:18,130 --> 00:47:21,490

Any sort of encouragement or

anything else that you feel like

:

00:47:21,490 --> 00:47:22,600

we didn't get to talk about today?

:

00:47:22,990 --> 00:47:26,080

Yeah, I feel like just overall like.

:

00:47:26,755 --> 00:47:28,495

I know this is like real, I'm

really passionate about this.

:

00:47:28,495 --> 00:47:29,725

Maori's really passionate about this.

:

00:47:29,725 --> 00:47:32,095

It's just like that

people don't feel alone.

:

00:47:32,185 --> 00:47:32,455

Yeah.

:

00:47:32,455 --> 00:47:33,595

Especially if you're Catholic.

:

00:47:33,595 --> 00:47:36,325

Like I think sometimes we almost

feel like a little bit of shame

:

00:47:36,325 --> 00:47:38,965

that we're like not in the season

of life that we hope to be in.

:

00:47:38,995 --> 00:47:39,085

Mm-hmm.

:

00:47:39,445 --> 00:47:42,385

Uh, and just like to not forget

that there's like other women who

:

00:47:42,385 --> 00:47:43,885

are like in the thick of it too.

:

00:47:44,260 --> 00:47:46,420

Um, and just to like not lose hope either.

:

00:47:46,450 --> 00:47:46,510

Yeah.

:

00:47:46,510 --> 00:47:48,640

Like that's one of the biggest

things that, you know, I

:

00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:49,990

wrestle with every single day.

:

00:47:50,050 --> 00:47:52,780

Um, but yeah, to not lose hope and

to like know that there's other

:

00:47:52,780 --> 00:47:55,480

people out there who are experiencing

what you're experiencing also.

:

00:47:55,540 --> 00:47:55,750

Yeah.

:

00:47:56,020 --> 00:47:56,680

Absolutely.

:

00:47:56,830 --> 00:47:57,070

Yeah.

:

00:47:57,100 --> 00:47:57,460

Lovely.

:

00:47:57,460 --> 00:47:59,200

Thank you so much for sharing

your heart with us today.

:

00:47:59,200 --> 00:47:59,260

Yeah.

:

00:47:59,260 --> 00:48:00,550

Thank you so much for having me.

:

00:48:00,550 --> 00:48:01,330

This is so good.

:

00:48:01,965 --> 00:48:03,885

Let's just end in a prayer.

:

00:48:03,945 --> 00:48:04,035

Yeah.

:

00:48:04,065 --> 00:48:07,365

For all those who are going

through fertility problems, um,

:

00:48:07,395 --> 00:48:10,275

pregnancy loss, and just on their

journey to build their families.

:

00:48:10,335 --> 00:48:11,175

I love that Name.

:

00:48:11,175 --> 00:48:12,165

The father, son, holy Spirit.

:

00:48:12,165 --> 00:48:12,495

Amen.

:

00:48:13,035 --> 00:48:16,785

Mother Mary, we ask for your

intercession, um, for Allie and I and

:

00:48:16,785 --> 00:48:20,415

our journeys as well as all those that

are listening and the people that they

:

00:48:20,415 --> 00:48:23,625

have in their lives that are going

through infertility and pregnancy loss.

:

00:48:23,625 --> 00:48:26,170

Um, that you would just cover

them in your mantle, protect

:

00:48:26,170 --> 00:48:28,870

them and intercede for them, and

give them the gift of motherhood.

:

00:48:28,870 --> 00:48:31,480

If it's the Lord's will, uh, we pray.

:

00:48:31,480 --> 00:48:33,730

Hail Mary, full of grace,

the Lord is with thee.

:

00:48:33,760 --> 00:48:36,970

Blessed our thou among women, and

blessed is the fruit of thy wom Jesus.

:

00:48:37,240 --> 00:48:41,020

Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us

sinners now and at the hour of our death.

:

00:48:41,050 --> 00:48:41,530

Amen.

:

00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:42,670

Name of the Father, son.

:

00:48:42,670 --> 00:48:43,090

Holy Spirit.

:

00:48:43,120 --> 00:48:43,450

Amen.

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About the Podcast

Ever Be
A faith and lifestyle podcast.
The Ever Be Podcast is a faith and lifestyle podcast filled with meaningful conversations and practical tips that will inspire and empower you to live a Christ centered life in today’s modern world. Through her own experience of surrendering completely to God and finding true fullness of life, your host Mari Wagner, has committed to having God’s praise “ever be” on her lips and sharing that message with the world. Listen in for insightful, real life conversations and actionable steps on how to claim the full life God created you for.

With over 100K followers and counting, Instagram content creator and founder of the popular Catholic lifestyle brand, West Coast Catholic, Mari Wagner is showing the world how to live a bold, attractive, and fulfilling Catholic life by being in the world but not of it. On the podcast you’ll get a combination of heartfelt solo episodes with Mari, interviews with exciting guests, and up-close and personal time with both the Wagner’s—Mari and Trey. What more could you ask for?!

Finally! Answers to questions you’ve been asking like:
How do I infuse prayer into my daily life? How do I live out my Catholic faith? What is the best dating and marriage advice? What does a good Catholic marriage look like? How do I grow in homemaking skills and build a domestic church? How do I create a beautiful and welcoming home? What does a healthy and balanced lifestyle look like? Is it possible to find a solid community of like minded women?

Host Mari Wagner covers topics that you actually care about from faith life, to relationships and marriage, to homemaking, to healthy living. Each episode is crafted to resonate with your challenges and aspirations as a modern Christian woman seeking purpose, balance, and joy.

Tune into the Ever Be Podcast for valuable advice, relatable stories, expert insights and just some fun girl chats with someone who really gets you. Hit play to get out of the rut you constantly feel yourself in, and subscribe to join the community and experience the fullness of life Jesus has in store for you.

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