Episode 61

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Published on:

21st May 2025

61: Turning Pain into Purpose: The Power of Redemptive Suffering | Megan Hjlemstad

Mari interviews Megan Hjlemstad about her book “Offer it Up” and the concept of redemptive suffering in a Christ-centered life. Megan shares her personal journey dealing with chronic illness, infertility, and the profound insights she gained through her suffering. Discover practical steps on how to offer up your sufferings to God without minimizing your pain and learn about the spiritual benefits for yourself and others. This episode is packed with encouragement and wisdom for anyone struggling with suffering.

Megan's Book Offer it Up

Megan's Website

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Transcript
Speaker:

Hey, I am your host, Mari Wagner,

and you're listening to The Ever Be

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Podcast where Faith Meets Lifestyle.

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I'm so excited you're here.

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Whether you're a new listener

or a longtime follower, I know

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there's something here for you.

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Pull up a chair and listen in for

insightful, real life conversations and

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actionable steps on how to claim the.

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Full life God created you for.

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If you're a woman desiring to live

a Christ-centered life in today's

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modern world, then this is for you.

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Welcome to ever be.

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Mari Wagner: Welcome back

to Ever Be everybody.

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I am so excited to have my friend

Megan on the podcast today.

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She wrote a really incredible book

amongst other beautiful writings

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that I know you've done in the

Catholic world, and many of us have

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probably prayed with them before.

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Um, so today we are gonna be

chatting about Megan's story and

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her book that she came out with.

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Offer it Up.

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I'll tell you guys, as I was

reading a few of the chapters,

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I knew it was a powerful read.

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So I'm excited to just be with her today

and kind of share her story and dive

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into all things redemptive suffering.

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So, Megan, welcome to Ever Be,

would you please introduce yourself?

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Megan Hjelmstad: so much Mari.

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It's a joy to be here.

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And yes, I have been in the

ministry world for, uh, a bit.

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I've been a long time team member

of blessed She, so I'm sure I've

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gotten to know some of you there.

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And, um, writing for

spiritual direction.com.

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But in my, in my real life,

in my 24 7 life, I am a wife.

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I am a mom of three beautiful kids.

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Um, one of 'em is our miracle baby after

we struggle to have kids and we, um,

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have a big fluffy white dog named Otto.

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We live in the Denver area.

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I've been in the military.

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I'm a veteran, um, for a total of 15

years or for five years on active duty.

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I met my husband at West Point.

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Then, um, got off active duty so I could

be a mom and stay home with my kids.

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Praise God.

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And continued on with the reserve thing,

kind of the one week and a month, um,

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two weeks a year for about 10 more years.

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So here, there, and everywhere.

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But, um, just, just such a gift to be

here and to have gone through not only

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this journey of, you know, all, all of

these high points, but also a lot of

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different health diagnoses in there and

learning the Lord's love through them.

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Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

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I'm so excited to, just to

hear more about your journey.

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So first of all, let's kick it off.

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What inspired you to write, offer it

up, and how did your personal journey

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with chronic illness that you share

in the book kind of shape its message

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Megan Hjelmstad: So the funny thing is,

because the Lord has a sense of humor

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is I did not set out to write this book.

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I set out to write another book.

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I was actually under contract to write.

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I worked on women's dignity and

identity and I kept running up

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against walls, um, in the process.

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And I was in the midst of recovering

from a surgery when I got a message on

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Instagram from a woman I had done some

speaking, some workshops on redemptive

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suffering, some writing here and there

in devotionals on redemptive suffering.

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And she said, Megan, do you have any

practical resources, like practical

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books that you can recommend for me?

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Because I am really struggling

with this one thing.

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And I just like, I don't know

how to deal with it day to day.

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And I thought, oh yeah,

let me, let me respond.

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Let me get you some resources right away.

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And I came up totally blank.

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And so I thought, oh, well, you

know, I know there's this beautiful

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encyclical by John Paul ii, which is

so inspiring, but it doesn't really get

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into the practicals or the how toss.

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By the next morning I had the download

of a chapter list from the Lord in my

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head, and I discerned it with my spiritual

director and just started writing out

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of obedience, even though I was nowhere

near, um, finished with this other book.

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And finally I brought it to my editor and

she said, this is the book that God wants.

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So it, it came directly from the Lord.

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Um, and it was, it was the book I

needed to read as I began going through

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all of my struggles with different

diagnoses, with endometriosis, with

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a, a degenerative spine disease called

ankylosing spondylitis, um, severe

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digestive issues among other things.

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And it, as I came to find out,

is the book that the message that

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we all need because we all face

suffering in our own way, whether

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it's physical, mental, emotional, and.

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To reconcile this truth that God is good

and yet we have suffering in this life.

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And how do we, how do we hold

the tension of that and how do

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we discover his presence in it?

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And what do we do with the big feelings

that come with it all went into this book.

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all of all of my wrestling, and the way

that the Lord has spoken to me through

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it, and the way that we can practically

approach our difficulties every single

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day through the lens of God's love.

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Mari Wagner: Yeah, I think you

said it so perfectly, that tension

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that we have to hold there.

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It really is.

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Um, I talked a little bit about it at

Seek, but it's such a paradox to like

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learn to love and trust the one who's, who

is allowing our cross to happen, right?

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Because there is kind of that both end

of just like the Lord is allowing this

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suffering, but it doesn't negate the fact

that he is good and that there is a plan

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and a redemption behind this suffering.

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But in our humanity it's just

so, it's hard to wrap our heads

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around that and hard to kind of

understand how there could be good.

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Through it.

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Um, and that's, I just think one

of the mysteries of our faith.

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but this, this phrase offer it up, I wanna

hear more about it because when you see

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it on the cover, it's big and it's bold.

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And I think in the Catholic

world, there's a lot of feelings

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around the phrase, offer it up.

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It like fires some people up and

they're like, yes, offer it up.

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That's what we're here to do in

this Catholic, you know, life.

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And then some people are turned

off by it and some people are

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like, don't tell me to offer it up.

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Like, what do you know?

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What does that mean?

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So I just wanna hear from you, like,

how do you unpack and kind of reclaim

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the true meaning of this phrase?

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Offer it up in your book.

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Megan Hjelmstad: Absolutely.

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Mari Wagner: Absolutely.

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Megan Hjelmstad: And it's, I,

I like to say that the title

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itself is almost tongue in cheek.

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It's very confronting because so many

people do have experiences with mothers.

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Grandmothers saying, offer it up.

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And that, especially in my experience

in the military, means suck it up.

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Like we're gonna just push it aside.

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We're gonna ignore it.

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We're gonna drive on.

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We're not going to acknowledge

our suffering because that.

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Means that we're being weak,

that we are being needy, um,

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who wants to hear about it?

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This isn't something we talk about, so

offer it up in the sense that I understood

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it in my, you know, growing up in, in

the:

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really talked about, just meant we're,

we're gonna, we're gonna brush it aside.

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We don't need

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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Megan Hjelmstad: address this.

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Um, and in reality, offering our

suffering means inviting the Lord into it.

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So it is very confronting in the facts

that it requires us to acknowledge

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our suffering and acknowledge it

in such a way that we understand

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both the true difficulty of it.

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So we're not minimizing our suffering

compared to other people's 'cause that's

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very easy to do, but we're also not giving

it more power than it's due over us.

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We, we don't say this suffering

completely defines me, or I

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am a helpless victim of this.

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We acknowledge the difficulty and

then we invite God into it, and in

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inviting God into our suffering,

the Lord redeems all things.

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That's why he came to earth.

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That's why he took on flesh.

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He experienced a body.

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The enemy does not have a body,

but the Lord has a body so that he

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can experience the fullness of the

difficulty of our humanity and the

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goodness of our humanity, both again,

intention and bring good out of every

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single suffering that we experience.

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He redeems all of it.

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So in acknowledging our suffering, and

not just acknowledging it, but inviting

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the Lord into it, even though suffering

itself is a mystery, we understand

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that the Lord brings about a far

greater good than the suffering itself.

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So every single suffering

that we offer to the Lord, he

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completely overturns victoriously.

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For our good in the context of

eternity and just silences the

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evil of the suffering itself.

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So that is what redemptive suffering

actually is in reality with the Lord.

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It's, it's looking at this difficulty

and saying, this is really rough,

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and also it has eternal value.

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When I allow the Lord and

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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Megan Hjelmstad: it to the

Lord, we become victorious.

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We become filled with

purpose in our suffering.

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We're we're not just powerless anymore.

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Mari Wagner: Hmm.

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That is so true.

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I am just like reflecting back on just

the journey of our own cross right

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now, struggling with infertility and

just kind of all the stages that I've

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experienced over the years before really

stepping into this season of suffering I

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had never truly, truly suffered before.

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Um, and so it was a very new experience

and I think for, for a while.

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Kind of what you're saying of like,

you have to invite the Lord to

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be able to offer it to him again.

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I feel like the word that comes

to mind is like acceptance.

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Like you have to come to a place where

you accept like, this is part of my story.

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Like this is reality of what

I'm experiencing right now.

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And once you come to kind of embrace

is a, is a tough word to use here

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because embrace almost has like

a, like a warmth to it, you know?

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But once you come to embrace as part

of your story, like then your heart

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is free to offer it back to the

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Megan Hjelmstad: Yeah.

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Mari Wagner: And finally, I feel

like that's kind of that full circle

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moment where the Lord has been waiting

to carry it for you and with you

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instead of like putting it all on

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Megan Hjelmstad: Mm-hmm.

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Mari Wagner: it takes those steps to

accept your story, to then have the like.

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Humility of heart to be like, okay,

Lord, like gonna give it back to you.

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Like, what do you wanna do with it?

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Um, and I think that that is

like a, that's a big challenge.

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And I know for me, probably the first year

and a half I was in so much denial and

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I was like, God just got the wrong girl.

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Like I think God actually just like

swapped the stories of two of his

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daughters and he didn't mean to do this.

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And for a while I was just like waiting

for that positive pregnancy test.

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'cause I was like, this isn't

my story, this isn't my story.

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And when I actually came to

accept that and be like, oh, this

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is, this is part of the story.

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The Lord is writing in my

life and in my marriage, and

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there is purpose to his plan.

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Like now I can accept that

and offer it back to him to

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see like what he has in store.

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That's when I began to see fruit in the

suffering and in my relationship with God.

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So I love that you kind

of touched on that.

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Megan Hjelmstad: Yeah.

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Yeah, for sure.

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And you know, it is so

important to understand that

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it's, it's such a human thing.

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We're human and we can't escape our

humanity no matter how hard we try.

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I've tried my whole life

and it doesn't work.

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I, I can't be perfect.

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I can't stop feeling these feelings.

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And they're real and they're raw, but

the Lord is not overwhelmed by that.

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He's not afraid of that.

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And he says himself in the

garden, father, take this cap.

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He cries out times, you know, so the Lord

isn't deterred by the time it takes us.

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And it, it's like grief.

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It's a process.

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There's anger, there's

denial, there is escape there.

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There are all of these

things that we go to first.

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And even when we get into, you

know, I've gotten into this, what I

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call muscle memory of offering now.

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But even with that, there are days where

maybe it's mid-morning and I think, oh.

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Well, I've been grumpy about this all

day, but I haven't offered it yet.

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Sorry, Lord.

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Here we go.

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But he, he is not deterred by that.

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He is so patient with our

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Mari Wagner: Mm

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Megan Hjelmstad: when we are working

toward that place of offering it

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and, and surrendering it to him.

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And in fact, I think those moments,

and I would love to get into this

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later too, they have even more value.

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He even tells St.

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Paulino that, that these most difficult

moments of turning over our will and

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trying to accept that this is part

of our story, trying to reconcile

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the fact that I have to deal with

this, even though I don't want to.

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Those offerings become the most valuable

and the most filled with life and

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Mari Wagner: mm

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Megan Hjelmstad: for other people as well.

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I love St.

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Faina.

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Cannot wait to get into that.

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You mentioned in the book that our

suffering can, you know, benefit

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not just us, but others as well.

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So how does that work spiritually?

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I.

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Megan Hjelmstad: Yeah.

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So when the Lord became incarnate, when

Jesus, the word took on flesh, everything

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he experienced, if you think about it

coming from heaven into this, this tiny

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little human body from the expanse of

paradise into this little human body,

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everything for him was a suffering

from that moment on compared to heaven.

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And so in taking on flesh and taking

on the human condition and entering

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into the entire human condition, not

just coming as, you know, a man, as my

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sons would say, you know, in Minecraft,

not just spawning randomly, you know,

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in, in the middle of his thirties,

but becoming a, a zygote in the womb.

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Our Lord has sanctified every single

moment of our human existence.

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So that everything that we experience

in our soul, in our mind, in our

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body, in our flesh, can be redeemed.

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So his divinity in becoming united

with humanity means that our humanity,

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he can elevate that to the divine.

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So everything in this fallen world that

the enemy intends for our ill, through

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Christ's incarnation, through his all

redemptive act on the cross of his

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passion, death, and ultimate resurrection,

all of the things that we experience

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from the enemy can be overturned through

the power of Christ's incarnation,

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his resurrection and, and his, his

passion and death for victory for life.

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So Christ took every single

suffering up to and including

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the ultimate suffering of death.

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And overturned it for life.

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And he did not do that by taking

it away, which is the really

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hard part for us as humans.

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He, he doesn't talk us

out of the dark valley.

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He doesn't take away suffering.

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He didn't take away death.

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He transformed the effects of it.

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And that's the difference, is that

we still experience suffering.

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But suffering itself does not

have to be a death anymore.

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It can bring life and it, it happens

through Christ, but we have free will.

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Right?

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So Christ invites us to be his coworkers.

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He invites us into all of his work.

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He doesn't have to, he doesn't

need us at all, but He wants us.

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The, the Lord wants us.

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And so everything that he invites us

into, we have the choice to say, yes,

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I want to cooperate with that or not.

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So whenever we invite Christ into our

suffering, whenever we offer it to

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him, uniting it, him coming to us, us.

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It becomes redeemed.

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And, and that's how it works.

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It becomes filled with God's life,

God's victory, when, on the other

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hand, absent of it, of him without him.

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When we don't do that,

it just remains empty.

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It remains devoid of life.

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It just remains, um, you know, in this

fallen world, the evil that it truly

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Mari Wagner: Mm.

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Megan Hjelmstad: So when we invite

God into our suffering, when we say,

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Lord, I give this to you, I offer

it to you, I surrender it to you.

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All of it not only becomes filled

with God's life, but we understand

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that when we pray for others, it's,

it's intercessory prayer, right?

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We're asking for good things

for other people so we can

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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Megan Hjelmstad: with our words, but

we can also pray with our actions.

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And so act of offering our suffering,

it becomes intercessory prayer.

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So it's not just helping us to come

out of ourselves and to recognize God's

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presence and suffering, but it's truly.

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Bringing God's love into our suffering so

that he can be able to expand it and, and

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fill it with life and let it overflow.

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As it as everything that we

offer to him naturally does

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for the good of other people.

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It becomes his, his divine

work in the kingdom.

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For others, I can say, Lord,

I invite you into this.

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I offer it to you.

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I give it to you.

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And I can also attach

an attention to that.

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I can say for Mari and her, her

desire to have a family, I can offer

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it for someone I know who's really

struggling with an illness right now.

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And, uh, maybe even at the point

of death, I can offer it for

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my kids and their vocations.

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I, I can offer it for all sorts

of things for a situation.

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You know, my husband was traveling this

past weekend and there were some toss,

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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Megan Hjelmstad: and so I'm

saying, Lord, I'm scared and I'm

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offering my fear for, for his.

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Safe return, you know?

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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Megan Hjelmstad: it doesn't mean that

we're, we are trying to force God's

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hand in any way, but we're inviting

graces that cannot be unlocked in

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any other way because they require

our cooperation with the Lord.

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'cause he gives us free will.

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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That's super powerful.

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And I feel like it's, it's almost

us entering into that is almost,

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like you were saying, like

mimicking what Jesus did for us.

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It's like emulating his act of

transforming suffering into life

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and using our suffering, offering

it to the Lord so he can transform

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it into life and attaching those

intentions, um, to our suffering.

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And I was, I was sharing this with

Megan before we hit record, but

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as I was reading some of the book,

I was realizing like, oh my gosh.

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Like I haven't intentionally

done this in, in my journey.

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And that took me by surprise as, you

know, someone who strives to be a faithful

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Catholic who's heard this message before.

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I think it's so.

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In our humanity.

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It's so easy to get swept up in our

own suffering and really, really

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focus inward, which I think there's

a lot of understanding and grace

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that we can hold for that space.

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But also, I felt encouraged by this

message just to realize like, look

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like I can use my suffering for the

goodness of others as well, and allow

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the Lord to use it, not just to redeem

my, my life, my story, my soul, but

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also others, um, which I think is, is so

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Megan Hjelmstad: Mm-hmm.

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Yes,

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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Megan Hjelmstad: And I,

I would love to bring St.

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Fina in here because it was

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Mari Wagner: Yeah.

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Megan Hjelmstad: one of

the turning points for me.

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I, and, and so just kind of as a, a more

detailed background, I, um, was diagnosed

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with endometriosis pretty early on.

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Um, shortly after my husband and

I got married, I, I had started

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dealing with the pain at age 14.

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And so going through all of my military

training and everything, it was, it

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was kind of getting in the way and

I was like, what do I do with this?

367

:

You know?

368

:

Um, we, we were very, very blessed

with two children, um, right after

369

:

we got married, although it was

really tough when I was working

370

:

full-time in the Army, and there's a

lot of, a lot of isolation in that.

371

:

But then we had two pregnancy losses,

um, and one was a, a really tragic

372

:

ectopic pregnancy, um, for which

I had to have emergency surgery.

373

:

And so when I, I kind of.

374

:

Got to that place of, oh wow,

this isn't just pain, like this is

375

:

affecting the deep desires of my heart.

376

:

I wanted that huge Catholic family and,

you know, I, it was just heartbreaking.

377

:

And I, I was to the point where

I was even feeling numb, like

378

:

I just, this, this half-hearted

prayer to our family patron St.

379

:

Jude, who had prayed my husband into

the church when we were in college.

380

:

And I, I said, it'd be really nice

to just, to raise even one more baby.

381

:

And I later found out that I was

expecting sooner than, um, I, I

382

:

anticipated after that surgery and our

son was then both due and born on St.

383

:

Jude's Feast Day.

384

:

And so it, it was kind of this like

all of a sudden realization that, oh

385

:

wow, may, maybe God's not just distant.

386

:

Am I suffering?

387

:

Maybe

388

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

389

:

Megan Hjelmstad: actually right

here in the midst of it, in.

390

:

Details in ways that I can't even fathom.

391

:

And there have been so many times

that I have prayed and asked St.

392

:

Jude for things for physical healing

since then, that haven't happened.

393

:

You know?

394

:

And there have been so many prayers

that I've prayed for other people that

395

:

have been answered in ways I, I've

expected, and ways that, you know, I,

396

:

I was hoping it wouldn't be answered.

397

:

And, and so being able to understand

through that miracle for us, that the

398

:

Lord is listening and he's in the details,

and when the answer doesn't turn out the

399

:

way we desire, he's still in the details

and he's working it together for good.

400

:

Even that, if that good is only visible

in the context of eternity, it really

401

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

402

:

Megan Hjelmstad: my heart to be able

to be more honest with the word.

403

:

And I think that

404

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

405

:

Megan Hjelmstad: the place where we

have to start, is just that honesty,

406

:

that raw honesty of, Lord, this is.

407

:

Really rough.

408

:

And I, and I, I don't wanna do this

praying that, that garden prayer, like,

409

:

Lord, take this away, but taking it

to the Lord instead of just being in

410

:

our own heads and being in isolation

in it, allows him to come in with his

411

:

truth, with his help, with his strength.

412

:

And so Jesus says to St.

413

:

Faustina, and this, this was a real

turning point for me after I began to

414

:

understand the Lord's presence and,

and kind of like you really be able

415

:

to digest the message of redemptive,

416

:

Jesus said, you'll save more souls.

417

:

Through your prayers and sufferings than

will a missionary and all his teachings

418

:

and sermons, which is just wild because in

419

:

Mari Wagner: Wild.

420

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Ari and the speaking

that I do, it's like, I mean, that

421

:

feels really, you know, big and intense.

422

:

A lot of times it's like speaking

people focusing on the message.

423

:

And yet

424

:

Mari Wagner: Yes.

425

:

Megan Hjelmstad: when we think about

the fact that we can make an impact

426

:

on a soul in a far more powerful way,

simply by lying in bed and lifting

427

:

our pain to the Lord, that is wild.

428

:

I mean, it shows the value of our

suffering and why the enemy doesn't

429

:

want us to, to turn outward, why

he wants us to remain inward.

430

:

But to me, the most encouraging

thing, um, that Jesus says to

431

:

Saint Fina, he goes on to say.

432

:

Do not be afraid if you experience

repugnant and dislike for suffering.

433

:

Repugnant is a really strong word.

434

:

It's a really strong dislike.

435

:

And so

436

:

Mari Wagner: I have definitely felt that.

437

:

Megan Hjelmstad: he says, don't be

afraid if you experience repugnant

438

:

and dislike for suffering, because

all its power rests in the will.

439

:

And so these contrary feelings far from

lowering the degree of the sacrifice in

440

:

my eyes, will enhance it, which is just,

441

:

Mari Wagner: Wow.

442

:

Megan Hjelmstad: mean, talk

about our humanity and the, the

443

:

tension and the wrestling and the

difficulty of offering our suffering.

444

:

It's even

445

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

446

:

Megan Hjelmstad: when it's harder.

447

:

Mari Wagner: It really is.

448

:

Gosh, that is so good.

449

:

I need to go back and open up her diary.

450

:

I, I mean, read, say,

I've been reading St.

451

:

Fina's diary.

452

:

It is such a thick book, so it has

taken like years to get through.

453

:

I'm not

454

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yes,

455

:

Mari Wagner: it.

456

:

Megan Hjelmstad: same.

457

:

Mari Wagner: now and then I

pick it up and you just have

458

:

to digest like piece by piece.

459

:

But there's these gold nuggets

like that in there that I just feel

460

:

like totally like change approach

to your relationship with God.

461

:

It's almost just like a whole

new like facet of like formation,

462

:

like spiritually that we get just

from like these little nuggets.

463

:

And that was super powerful.

464

:

To hear.

465

:

She has so many other quotes

in there too about suffering.

466

:

Some of them that I love that have

carried me through this journey as

467

:

well, is that Jesus tells her not to be

afraid of suffering because when we are

468

:

suffering is when he's the closest to

469

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yes.

470

:

Mari Wagner: And that

was beautiful to hear.

471

:

'cause I think for anyone who's, you

know, in a journey of deep suffering,

472

:

it's so, it's so easy to just fall into

a place where we feel like the Lord

473

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yeah.

474

:

Mari Wagner: or where we feel

like he is the most distant he's

475

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Mm-hmm.

476

:

Mari Wagner: And I think it's easy

for us to fall into that because.

477

:

It is almost like we, you know,

our, our perce, our perception of

478

:

the father sometime is like, he's

a good dad who wants to fulfill

479

:

every desire, which is true.

480

:

But then when some desires aren't

fulfilled in the way that we

481

:

thought, we kind of, that, that

the image gets distorted as like,

482

:

well, maybe he doesn't hear me.

483

:

Maybe he doesn't wanna give me my heart's

desires, you know, maybe he's not with me.

484

:

And Jesus really kind of

hones in that message in St.

485

:

T's Dry, where he's like, suffering

doesn't mean the Lord is far.

486

:

It actually means like, I am the

closest with you and I am like

487

:

bearing this suffering with you.

488

:

and one thing too that comes to mind

that I just wanna share, I shared

489

:

this in my Lent devotional this past

year, which was about suffering.

490

:

It was called Through the Thorns and.

491

:

Before I, I experienced the

suffering of infertility.

492

:

The Lord began to prepare me even

years in advance with almost like a

493

:

prophetic moment in, in adoration once

where he kind of like foretold that

494

:

there was a cross coming in my life.

495

:

And what he said to me was, I myself

will be crucified in you, fear not

496

:

for there will be a resurrection.

497

:

And at the time I had

no idea what that meant.

498

:

Um, and I spent like maybe like

two years trying to figure out

499

:

like, what is this big cross?

500

:

And I, I hadn't,

experienced it yet, but I.

501

:

the first few years of our, of

our infertility journey, that

502

:

beca began to come back to mind.

503

:

And I began to realize the Lord is not

asking me to die on this cross alone.

504

:

Like he's not asking me to be crucified.

505

:

He's asking for me to invite him and to

allow himself to be crucified in my life.

506

:

And that just shows like the closeness

we have in deep suffering to the Lord we

507

:

might not otherwise have that opportunity.

508

:

Uh, so that I think is such a, is

such a powerful message to share and

509

:

highly encourage anybody to read St.

510

:

Faina.

511

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yeah.

512

:

Mari Wagner: Um.

513

:

So thank you for sharing that.

514

:

But one thing I wanted to note too

is as you share your story and all

515

:

these beautiful truths, you speak

with such confidence and peace, and

516

:

I think that's really challenging.

517

:

Um, how do you find purpose

and peace in the midst of your

518

:

own suffering and your story?

519

:

And do you have any practical tools

that you can share with people

520

:

that might be in a similar journey?

521

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Well, I would love to get

into the practical stuff, but first I have

522

:

to say, how, how do you find that piece?

523

:

Just a lot of wrestling.

524

:

A lot of being real.

525

:

I mean, just complete

honesty with the Lord.

526

:

And I think that is such a gift of the

spiritual life and, and the journey

527

:

into relationship with the Lord is that

the closer you get to him, the more you

528

:

discover that you have to be daughter,

just as you were, you were saying.

529

:

And you, you have to be a child.

530

:

You have to be able to be that toddler

who throws the temper, tantrum with the

531

:

Lord and says, I don't wanna do this.

532

:

Why are you allowing this?

533

:

But we have to take it to him.

534

:

We have to wrestle over it with him,

because if we're just doing it in our

535

:

own heads, nature abhors the vacuum.

536

:

And so of course, if there's a vacuum

of God who's gonna swoop in and

537

:

try to influence and, and give us

an interpretation, the enemy will.

538

:

And we know that He does not want us

to know the power of our suffering.

539

:

He does not want us to know

God's presence in our suffering.

540

:

He does not want us to

know that God has a very.

541

:

Very good plan, even greater than

we can imagine for all of this

542

:

difficulty that we're going through.

543

:

And so, um, it, I mean it really

comes down to, in every difficult

544

:

moment, taking it to the Lord.

545

:

'cause he can take it.

546

:

He is, he is a good father.

547

:

He can take every single tantrum

and he is just, he is just

548

:

Mari Wagner: that's

549

:

Megan Hjelmstad: be so patient.

550

:

He is gonna wait on us.

551

:

He's going to wait with us.

552

:

Um, he's gonna hold us.

553

:

My, my youngest, um, not my youngest,

sorry, my, my middle when he was very

554

:

young, we would have to sometimes do

during a meltdown that kind of the

555

:

bear hug so he could still regulate.

556

:

And

557

:

Mari Wagner: Yes.

558

:

Megan Hjelmstad: I mean, that's

just how we are with the Lord.

559

:

That's who we're as

daughters, as children.

560

:

And so yeah, the peace comes,

um, not by trying to avoid those

561

:

big feelings, but by really.

562

:

Taking those big feelings to the

Lord because we're gonna have him.

563

:

And so often we wanna

skip over the lesson to

564

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

565

:

Megan Hjelmstad: to the

constellation, right?

566

:

We don't wanna go through the

dark valley with the Lord, but

567

:

he's in the, that's where he is.

568

:

He is in the valley.

569

:

He's in the valley with us.

570

:

He's in the pit.

571

:

And he knows we have to go through that

in order to be able to move forward.

572

:

Um,

573

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

574

:

Megan Hjelmstad: when we're in that

place, what can we do practically

575

:

is the million dollar question.

576

:

I am, I am one of those who's like,

okay, that's a really good truth.

577

:

Lord, that's a really good insight.

578

:

But tell me how, like, you gotta

tell me how, 'cause I can't,

579

:

like I can't do this human.

580

:

So, um, I would love to share kind

of three things that I was able to go

581

:

into a lot greater depth in the book.

582

:

Um, but just kind of three takeaways

that can help you get started.

583

:

And those are, um, offering ahead of time.

584

:

The second is what I lovingly call

my redemptive routine, and the

585

:

third is offering in the moment.

586

:

So, um, offering ahead of

time, God is outside time.

587

:

He is always prepared to

receive our prayer, whether

588

:

it's before, during, or after.

589

:

And so offering ahead of time, one

of the, the most simple ways to do

590

:

that is a basic morning offering.

591

:

And there are wonderful morning offerings

that you can, um, look up that you can

592

:

memorize on the U-S-C-C-B on hallow, you

know, you name it, the internet has it.

593

:

Um.

594

:

But a basic mourning offering based

on, uh, a French priest who wrote it

595

:

in 1865 for his, his missionaries says

something to the effect of, oh my Jesus,

596

:

through the immaculate heart of Mary,

I, I offer you my prayers, my works,

597

:

my joys, and my sufferings of this day.

598

:

So it covers all the bases

like you're, you're covered.

599

:

And so going into your day, if

you're just simply saying that

600

:

prayer, or even more simply nothing

that you memorized, but just, Lord,

601

:

I offer everything in this

day to you, please help be

602

:

sufficient to give God permission.

603

:

'cause remember, we have free will

to give God your consent, to let

604

:

him take everything in your day

and use it for good, for your good.

605

:

And for.

606

:

When we get into, you know, traffic

and we're really annoyed and frustrated

607

:

and being human about it and not

being perfect, um, you know, the Lord

608

:

can use that and, and he can make

good of it in the light of eternity.

609

:

When we are dealing with something

that's maybe so painful that we can't

610

:

even string two cohesive thoughts

together later, we offered ahead of time.

611

:

And so the board remembers that even when

we forget, even when we can't think of it.

612

:

And he will honor that offering and

say, I will use this for your good, my

613

:

daughter, and for the good of others.

614

:

So offering ahead of time,

super simple, easy way to just,

615

:

Mari Wagner: I love

616

:

Megan Hjelmstad: yeah, take, take

whatever is going to happen and let the,

617

:

the sufferings have merit in eternity

to store up treasures in heaven to let.

618

:

Deeper and greater to let the work,

um, be filled with life instead of just

619

:

kind of a, a checkbox on your to-do list

that fades into the passage of time.

620

:

So offering ahead of

time is the first thing.

621

:

The second thing, redemptive routine.

622

:

I kind of came across this

concept, I feel like is like this

623

:

light gave me when I was on, um.

624

:

Uh, an apostle it called

the Seven Sisters.

625

:

The seven sisters team offering,

which offers a holy hour each day

626

:

of the week for specific priests.

627

:

So I was offering a holy hour

every Tuesday for my pastor and I

628

:

started to ramp up with my health.

629

:

Um, I, about four years ago was diagnosed

with a degenerative spine disease.

630

:

So I have trouble walking when I get up.

631

:

Some people end up in a

wheelchair eventually with it,

632

:

and it's not gonna get better.

633

:

It's only gonna get worse.

634

:

So, you know, it got harder

to get outta the house.

635

:

I was running late a lot of times,

just normally not just 'cause of my

636

:

chronic illness, um, to this holy hour.

637

:

And so I'm like, oh, okay, well

I'm gonna offer on the drive on the

638

:

way there, you know, for my pastor.

639

:

And so it gotta the point where I realized

I can offer everything in my day for him.

640

:

Okay.

641

:

Mari Wagner: Hmm

642

:

Megan Hjelmstad: That's wonderful.

643

:

And then it naturally translated

to other days of the week.

644

:

So I was getting this wonderful email

on Wednesdays about praying and fasting

645

:

for our spouses, for our husbands.

646

:

And so I thought, oh, Wednesday

I can, I can offer everything

647

:

on Wednesday for my husband.

648

:

And it just grew Thursday, a lot of

ministry work and mentorship for women.

649

:

And so I began to offer for my

ministry and community Fridays for

650

:

my bishop, my spiritual director

for a, um, cloistered sister friend.

651

:

I have Saturdays, my kids all play hockey,

so I was, you know, really not loving

652

:

having to get up and, and drive them.

653

:

And I don't, I don't run warm.

654

:

So hockey rinks aren't the

most comfortable place.

655

:

Yeah.

656

:

Mari Wagner: Cold.

657

:

Megan Hjelmstad: So just being able to

offer those things that I didn't re,

658

:

I really didn't wanna do for, yeah.

659

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

660

:

Megan Hjelmstad: for their

future, for their sanctity.

661

:

Sundays, I began offering for priests.

662

:

Mondays are, you know, the hardest day of

the week for most people, including me.

663

:

And so I began offering for all of

those, um, who might be the most

664

:

hard and sinners or those in need of

conversion, those close to death, um, just

665

:

Mari Wagner: Hmm.

666

:

Megan Hjelmstad: their

souls, for their salvation.

667

:

And then we're at Tuesday

again, and so I realized I can

668

:

do this every day of the week.

669

:

You can also do it with specific

tasks, you know, if there's a, a

670

:

task that you really don't wanna do.

671

:

I've never been great at meal

planning and making meals, so

672

:

offering that for my family.

673

:

But the beautiful thing about, for me,

for regarding the days of the week is

674

:

that oftentimes when I'm waking up in the

middle of the night with, I have a lot of,

675

:

um, digestive issues and waking up in the

middle of the night in pain and dealing

676

:

with chronic illness, insomnia again

for hours in the middle of the night.

677

:

I've gone through that, that, you

know, natural human reaction that

678

:

we talked about earlier where I,

I start to bargain with the Lord.

679

:

I beg him to take it away.

680

:

I tell him all the things I'll do if

he makes it stop and lets me sleep.

681

:

You know, I, I get angry.

682

:

I, you know, tell him if you,

if you're allowing this, why

683

:

did you give me this vocation?

684

:

Because now I have to get up and

be able to take care of my kids.

685

:

And

686

:

Mari Wagner: My

687

:

Megan Hjelmstad: so why

688

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

689

:

Megan Hjelmstad: this

and I have this vocation.

690

:

Why don't you just make me

an nun so I could suffer in

691

:

peace and you know, myself.

692

:

So I,

693

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

694

:

Megan Hjelmstad: of this, as I go

through that trajectory of natural

695

:

human feelings, eventually it always

occurs to me, oh yeah, what day is it?

696

:

I don't wanna be awake right

now, but what day is it again?

697

:

What do I have coming up on the calendar?

698

:

Oh, it's Tuesday.

699

:

Oh, this is for my pastor.

700

:

That's right.

701

:

And kind of having that rhythm, that

routine that, that happens over and

702

:

over again, just allows me to kind of

key into this is for something bigger

703

:

than myself, this is for something

more eternal than this moment.

704

:

And so it really brings me, again, outta

myself and into that place of, oh, I, I

705

:

can, I can think of things beyond myself.

706

:

I can have purpose beyond this moment, and

707

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

708

:

Megan Hjelmstad: helps me to get

through the moment at the same time

709

:

that it's helping other people.

710

:

So,

711

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

712

:

Megan Hjelmstad: routine.

713

:

Mari Wagner: I love that.

714

:

I love the simplicity of just

like every day having a little

715

:

like purpose or attachment to

716

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yeah.

717

:

Mari Wagner: It, I feel like

is a small enough thing that

718

:

we can like, pick up routinely.

719

:

Um, so very

720

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yes.

721

:

Mari Wagner: Did you have a,

722

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yes.

723

:

And you know, we, we all have our,

our different intentions and, and

724

:

things that we can very easily,

um, tailor to life and, and our

725

:

needs and, and the people in them.

726

:

So the third thing is just as we kind

of develop those habits of offering, it

727

:

helps us to get to the place where we

can offer more reflexively in the moment.

728

:

And so, offering in the moment is

just, you know, last week I was

729

:

sick and I wasn't happy about it.

730

:

But then I realized, and, and even the

week before I was sick too, I realized,

731

:

oh, I can be offering this for the

conclave and for the Holy Father.

732

:

And that our new Holy Father was elected.

733

:

I had something of real value

to give and I was almost glad,

734

:

Mari Wagner: Hmm.

735

:

Megan Hjelmstad: wasn't glad, but I

was like almost thankful that I had

736

:

a little something more than normal

737

:

Mari Wagner: feeling?

738

:

Megan Hjelmstad: because it was such

a big deal and it was so important.

739

:

And I have learned through the boards.

740

:

Words and, and through St.

741

:

Calina and, and through, you know,

this life of redemptive suffering, how

742

:

valuable those offerings actually are.

743

:

So to be able to give something for

the good of the church was like, it was

744

:

very gratifying in the moment, you know.

745

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah, that is amazing.

746

:

One other question that I wanna make sure

that we get to, because we touched on it a

747

:

little bit at the beginning about how the

message of offer it up can sometimes be

748

:

received as like, minimize your suffering.

749

:

But you know, we've spoken to

the fact that that's not at

750

:

the heart of what it truly is.

751

:

Um, how do we offer our suffering to God

without minimizing like just the real.

752

:

Emotional or physical pain

that we may be experiencing.

753

:

Um, and this is kind of a twofold

question because you also touched

754

:

on it before about how sometimes

as women, like we compare our

755

:

suffering to others and sometimes

use that to minimize our own as well.

756

:

Um, so yeah, how, how would you respond to

757

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yeah.

758

:

I was so blessed to be able to write

a whole chapter on comparison and

759

:

suffering because I feel like for,

for me especially, and for so many

760

:

women, most women, I would venture to

say it is one of, it's at the heart

761

:

of the difficulty of life in general

as well as suffering comparison makes

762

:

its way into to everything we do.

763

:

And so to be able to understand that

suffering doesn't have to rule us,

764

:

but also we shall, should acknowledge

it, um, independent of what's

765

:

going on in other people's lives.

766

:

It's very free and very important.

767

:

So in this kind of truth of, um,

the fact that we, we have suffering.

768

:

We acknowledge our suffering, but someone

always has it worse than us, and someone

769

:

else always has it better than us.

770

:

It can

771

:

Mari Wagner: Uhhuh.

772

:

Megan Hjelmstad: be a temptation to

vanity, which is at its root, um,

773

:

caring what other people think, right?

774

:

Giving more, um, credence to what other

people think than what God thinks.

775

:

And so identity is, is worrying

about their opinion and or

776

:

pride, which is worrying about,

you know, am I doing it right?

777

:

You know, am am I doing this

in, in the way it should be?

778

:

And, and turning that

focus again in on myself.

779

:

And so the Parable of the Talents is

a, a really beautiful tool I think

780

:

for us in suffering where we, if, if

you read the parable of the talents,

781

:

one person gets 10, you know, or five

and conducts 10, another person gets.

782

:

So no matter the amount

of suffering we get.

783

:

We have the opportunity to offer it,

to invest it by giving it to the Lord

784

:

so that he can bring double out of it.

785

:

He can bring so much more value

out of it, or have the choice to

786

:

kind of bury it in the ground.

787

:

And that's where we begin to feel

the isolation and the despair.

788

:

And when we are kind of looking at,

you know, when, when I was dealing

789

:

with my miscarriages, I didn't fully

grieve them for a long time because I

790

:

was looking at other women who had had

stillbirths and much later term losses.

791

:

And I thought, well, my suffering

is nothing compared to theirs,

792

:

so I shouldn't feel this way.

793

:

So when we compare, we are tempted to

pass judgment on not only our suffering

794

:

itself, but how we respond to it.

795

:

And when we do that, it robs.

796

:

Us, it robs others of the

value of that suffering.

797

:

Mari Wagner: mm-hmm.

798

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Allow the

Lord into it, to redeem it as

799

:

fully as it could be redeemed.

800

:

And so when we compare in the sense of

minimizing, we don't allow the Lord to

801

:

bring as much redemption out of it and

in the process, we don't heal from it in

802

:

the way that we could with his presence.

803

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

804

:

Megan Hjelmstad: when we're dealing

with suffering, even when someone else

805

:

has it worse, it's very important to

say, again, with that kind of matter

806

:

of fact, this is, this is reality.

807

:

I'm dealing with this and it's hard,

and I have these human emotions and

808

:

these human even traumas a lot of times

associated with it, these very real fears.

809

:

And I don't need to shame myself for it.

810

:

The enemy wants to shame me, but

I'm not gonna to shame myself.

811

:

The lord's not shaming, shaming me for it.

812

:

Jesus himself never minimized

his suffering or anyone else's.

813

:

And so I can acknowledge it

and again, bring God into it.

814

:

Because the other end of that spectrum

in feeling victimized and feeling

815

:

isolated is I'm alone in this.

816

:

No one else understands.

817

:

No one else is dealing with this in the

way that I am, and that that woe is me.

818

:

That victimization mentality

brings us into despair and

819

:

hopelessness and powerlessness.

820

:

And so when we're minimizing it,

it robs our suffering of the value.

821

:

When we are feeling victimized by it,

it robs our suffering of the value.

822

:

It's the same effect on

both ends of the spectrum.

823

:

And so, you know, for example,

I, I can eat about 10 foods.

824

:

Um.

825

:

Total, and it's been that

way for many years now.

826

:

And I've had to spend, um, a lot

of time trying to figure out how

827

:

to, to receive the Eucharist.

828

:

And, and for many months

now have been having to fast

829

:

from receiving the Eucharist.

830

:

I, I can't receive low gluten host or

even the wine use for consecration because

831

:

it makes my throat start to close up.

832

:

And so I've really wrestled with this

and I battled with it, and I'm like,

833

:

Lord, why, why would you do this?

834

:

Why would you withhold yourself?

835

:

I mean, I, I understand that there could

be a greater good with this or that or

836

:

the other, but you know, in my human

reasoning, it seems like nothing is worse.

837

:

Like nothing else could

be comparative to this.

838

:

And yet, even if not as you described,

letting Christ be, what a beautiful

839

:

image, letting Christ be crucified in you.

840

:

Um, Theresa, she, she explains

that, um, in our suffering, we have

841

:

come close enough to the cross of

Christ for him to kiss us, the Lord,

842

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

843

:

Megan Hjelmstad: that.

844

:

In this particular suffering of having

to fast from his physical presence

845

:

himself, he's inviting me to be on

the cross with him and offer it for

846

:

the sake of others in a way that is

847

:

Mari Wagner: Hmm.

848

:

Megan Hjelmstad: powerful than if I were

at the foot of the cross receiving from

849

:

him, by joining him in that offering.

850

:

And so when we, when we allow that

victimization, the hopelessness prevails.

851

:

And it's not that we don't have those

feelings, but again, that we bring

852

:

those feelings to the, to the board

or in minimization that we say, okay,

853

:

well I'm trying to push this aside.

854

:

I'm looking at everyone else.

855

:

Lord, what do you have to

say about this suffering?

856

:

What do you wanna outta it?

857

:

So that in between the two extremes

is not only where the virtue

858

:

is, but it's where the Lord is.

859

:

It's where his love is, it's where

his, his sustenance is, and it's what

860

:

sustains us when everything else is.

861

:

Really trying to, I mean, so many

people, um, you know, they, they want

862

:

to fix our suffering or minimize it too.

863

:

And so we, we have all of these

messages that I've had people tell

864

:

me before, like, well, at least

you're not on a feeding tube.

865

:

And, you know, it's supposed to make

me feel better, but oh, the guilt that

866

:

comes with that, like, that's enough.

867

:

Or, or you could always adopt, you know,

I'm sure you hear that all the time.

868

:

And that was a very

particular calling, right?

869

:

It's a very particular calling.

870

:

It's not something Lord has

called us to, despite our

871

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

872

:

Megan Hjelmstad: ability

to have more children.

873

:

And so these are things that we,

we hear from the world, but in that

874

:

meme between the two extremes, when

we're feeling isolated or feeling

875

:

tempted to compare it to other

people and what should I be doing?

876

:

Or, or, you know, why

is this happening to me?

877

:

That we can take it to the board

and hold it out to him and say,

878

:

this is what I'm wrestling with.

879

:

This is what this person said.

880

:

What do you have to say about it?

881

:

What do you think about it?

882

:

What is your here Lord?

883

:

And that brings us into his reality

and his grace and his strength and

884

:

his fortitude to continue on in the

path of his redemption so that we're

885

:

not taking up extraneous crosses

that we need, don't need to take up.

886

:

And that we have the, the grace

to, as you said at the beginning,

887

:

to begin to learn to embrace the

cross that he is actually giving us.

888

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

889

:

As you were talking, I was kind of,

we, we've talked about this theme

890

:

throughout, just like this idea of

being a child with the Lord and having

891

:

the freedom to, to be a child with him.

892

:

And I was just receiving these

images from, you know, when, when

893

:

I was a kid and comparing our, the

way our family did things compared

894

:

to how our friends did things.

895

:

You know, be like, oh, well my friend

gets to do this and their parents let

896

:

them do this and they got to do this.

897

:

My mom would always say like,

worry about your own family.

898

:

You know, like, this is how

we do things in our family.

899

:

This is, you know, worry

about how we do things here.

900

:

We don't, we don't look at other

people's families and other

901

:

people's homes and compare.

902

:

And I feel like in a similar way, you

know, we might have those conversations

903

:

with the Lord about like, well, so and

so got this suffering, or so and so

904

:

didn't get this, or, you know, whatever.

905

:

The Lord might just be like.

906

:

I'm worrying about you.

907

:

You know, I'll worry about my children.

908

:

You worry about your, you

know, what I have given you.

909

:

And just this idea of like

living in our present moment.

910

:

The Lord does not live like in the

past or in the future, and he wants

911

:

us to focus on how he's working in

our lives in this present moment.

912

:

So that's just such a good reminder,

913

:

Megan Hjelmstad: And,

914

:

Mari Wagner: I think.

915

:

Go ahead.

916

:

Megan Hjelmstad: and the Lord even

says that in the gospels, right

917

:

when he's walking with Peter, right

after he, he says, Peter, upon

918

:

this rock, I will build my church.

919

:

Peter turns around and he looks at

John and he says, what about him?

920

:

And, and Jesus says, what?

921

:

You follow me?

922

:

You follow me.

923

:

Mari Wagner: Yep.

924

:

Yes.

925

:

Yes.

926

:

I think a good question to end

on here is what would you say

927

:

to the woman listening who feels

abandoned by God in her suffering?

928

:

Because I know this is an easy

place to get to in the midst

929

:

of darkness and deep suffering.

930

:

Um, what would you say to her

to encourage her in her journey?

931

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Yeah, I would say first

and foremost, go there with the Lord.

932

:

You, you've gotta go there.

933

:

You've gotta tell him that

you're feeling abandoned, that

934

:

you feel like he's not there.

935

:

Um, 'cause again, he

can take those things.

936

:

So be, be the daughter who's

willing to say that to him.

937

:

When I was diagnosed with my

degenerative spine disease, um, one

938

:

of the most, I I spent a few days in

kind of numbness, that denial, uh,

939

:

that you described so authentically

earlier, Mari, and just thinking, I.

940

:

Well, as long as I don't

end up in a wheelchair.

941

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

942

:

Megan Hjelmstad: Okay.

943

:

And that, that was the

condition that I set in my head.

944

:

And so a lot of times we don't

realize that we've kind of set these

945

:

conditions or said in terms of kind

of bargaining with that or fears.

946

:

As long as it's not X, y, or Z in terms

of a worst case scenario, I'll be okay.

947

:

And then when we come up against these

things for the possibility of these

948

:

things, we feel like the Lord has

not kept up his end of the the deal.

949

:

Um,

950

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

951

:

' Megan Hjelmstad: cause we are

thinking about it being able to

952

:

kind of play out in a certain way.

953

:

And so we really have to bring those

things to the Lord and even ask

954

:

him, what is underneath this Lord?

955

:

What is underneath my belief

that you've abandoned me?

956

:

What is underneath my feeling

of complete isolation?

957

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

958

:

Megan Hjelmstad: And when the

Lord in his goodness reveals

959

:

that because He does, he does.

960

:

When we're honest with him, we can then

bring that to him and hold it out to

961

:

him and say, okay, well, I'm afraid that

I'm going to end up in a wheelchair.

962

:

And when I, I kind of spent a

whole night locked in my room, ugly

963

:

crying, you know, dealing with this.

964

:

My, I finally got to the point of, of

bringing it to the Lord, and I realized

965

:

when I was going through all of these

fears with him, that it wasn't just a

966

:

fear of not being able to drive my kids

to school, or being able to travel and

967

:

the way I used to, or having to have,

you know, a house with accommodations

968

:

and, and all of these other things.

969

:

At the root of it, I was afraid that I

was going to lose myself and who I was,

970

:

Mari Wagner: Yeah.

971

:

Megan Hjelmstad: and

972

:

Mari Wagner: Yep.

973

:

Megan Hjelmstad: the

Lord was able to respond.

974

:

You can never lose who you are.

975

:

You are mine.

976

:

You are my daughter.

977

:

And so when we go there with the

Lord, he brings the light of truth

978

:

into it and he speaks to fears that

we don't even realize that we've been

979

:

holding or vows that we don't even

realize that we've made internally.

980

:

And

981

:

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

982

:

Megan Hjelmstad: it really is a process

that wading through the darkness of moving

983

:

toward the light and toward freedom.

984

:

So I, I could say I could, I

could share a lot of platitudes.

985

:

You are not alone.

986

:

It's not just you.

987

:

All of these are true.

988

:

But until you experience it and until

you go through it with the board,

989

:

um, you're not going to believe it.

990

:

But when

991

:

Mari Wagner: totally.

992

:

Megan Hjelmstad: have that

experience, nothing will be.

993

:

Mari Wagner: Totally.

994

:

That, yeah, that was so,

that was truth right there.

995

:

I mean, I've experienced

that in my own life too.

996

:

And like you said, you know, we

could say all the, all the right

997

:

things of like you, were not alone.

998

:

The alone, the Lord never abandons you.

999

:

He's always with you.

:

00:53:40,990 --> 00:53:43,870

He's closest to you in your suffering,

which we have said throughout

:

00:53:43,870 --> 00:53:46,180

this whole, um, episode today.

:

00:53:46,180 --> 00:53:49,870

But I, you know, know too well being

in a dark place and kind of hearing

:

00:53:49,870 --> 00:53:51,130

those things and just like, not.

:

00:53:51,870 --> 00:53:55,050

Receiving them well or not letting

them really land or you know, something

:

00:53:55,050 --> 00:53:58,560

in our heart is just not ready

to actually believe those things.

:

00:53:58,560 --> 00:54:02,550

And not until, like you said, you wrestle

with the Lord and he can handle it.

:

00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:06,840

I think for a long time it was just

like, you know, is this like not

:

00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:11,130

faithful of me to go to him and

show like that I doubted him, right?

:

00:54:11,130 --> 00:54:14,550

Or that I don't believe in his

faithfulness or his goodness or all

:

00:54:14,550 --> 00:54:18,120

these things and I feel like that

is just, it's a refinement of our

:

00:54:18,120 --> 00:54:21,720

soul and the Lord can handle it

and he wants us to show up to him.

:

00:54:21,720 --> 00:54:25,710

So honestly, and just like

raw, exactly how we are.

:

00:54:25,740 --> 00:54:28,860

'cause that's when he can actually

work in our hearts when he's like,

:

00:54:28,860 --> 00:54:31,290

finally you're being honest with me.

:

00:54:31,290 --> 00:54:35,040

You know, I can actually work in your

heart now and show you what the truth

:

00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:36,840

is, I think is really important.

:

00:54:37,185 --> 00:54:40,420

Megan Hjelmstad: And I would love to

just add, 'cause I'm, I'm, as you're

:

00:54:40,420 --> 00:54:44,200

saying this, I'm thinking, oh, this is

another objection I would have personally.

:

00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:48,310

And, you know, going through that and

that I have had, I wanna tell anyone who's

:

00:54:48,310 --> 00:54:50,260

dealing with this, you can handle it too.

:

00:54:50,500 --> 00:54:53,470

When you take it to the Lord,

you can handle it too, because

:

00:54:53,470 --> 00:54:56,620

he's gonna give you the grace to

deal with it so he can handle it.

:

00:54:56,855 --> 00:55:00,520

But also you can't, a lot of times we

think that we can't go there because

:

00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:04,120

we're gonna, we're gonna be too

weak to be able to move on from it.

:

00:55:04,180 --> 00:55:06,250

And, um, the, it's the opposite.

:

00:55:06,250 --> 00:55:07,210

That's actually true.

:

00:55:07,420 --> 00:55:10,325

When you go there with the Lord,

he gives you new strength and, and

:

00:55:10,325 --> 00:55:13,570

new ratitude and supernatural, um,

:

00:55:13,870 --> 00:55:14,090

Mari Wagner: Yep.

:

00:55:14,590 --> 00:55:15,430

Megan Hjelmstad: that we can't.

:

00:55:15,775 --> 00:55:17,785

Achieve only on our own human power.

:

00:55:18,955 --> 00:55:19,285

Mari Wagner: Mm-hmm.

:

00:55:20,005 --> 00:55:20,425

Wow.

:

00:55:20,575 --> 00:55:25,015

Thank you, Megan, for coming on today

and just sharing your story so vulnerably

:

00:55:25,015 --> 00:55:28,945

and honestly, and just speaking words

of encouragement to us listeners today.

:

00:55:29,275 --> 00:55:31,615

Megan Hjelmstad: Thank you so much

Mari, for having me and praying for

:

00:55:31,615 --> 00:55:33,895

you and, and all of the listeners.

:

00:55:35,035 --> 00:55:37,735

Mari Wagner: Where can we find

more about you and where can

:

00:55:37,735 --> 00:55:38,845

we find your book offered up?

:

00:55:39,145 --> 00:55:39,535

Megan Hjelmstad: Yes.

:

00:55:39,565 --> 00:55:42,325

So I am@meganhomesteaddo.com

:

00:55:42,715 --> 00:55:46,615

and I'll let Mari spell that 'cause I've

got a fun j in my name that's silent.

:

00:55:46,615 --> 00:55:48,955

So megan homestead do.com

:

00:55:48,955 --> 00:55:52,405

and then the book offer it

up, discovering the power and

:

00:55:52,405 --> 00:55:53,755

purpose of redemptive suffering.

:

00:55:53,815 --> 00:55:56,095

Uh, it's best to get it at the St.

:

00:55:56,335 --> 00:55:58,465

Paul Center, st paul center.com.

:

00:55:58,495 --> 00:56:00,295

That's st paul center.com.

:

00:56:00,715 --> 00:56:02,365

Amazon is not a great place.

:

00:56:02,365 --> 00:56:04,615

It's been in and out of

stock for whatever reason.

:

00:56:04,615 --> 00:56:06,325

So yeah, just go to the St.

:

00:56:06,325 --> 00:56:07,765

Paul Center and you'll be good.

:

00:56:08,965 --> 00:56:09,355

Mari Wagner: Perfect.

:

00:56:09,415 --> 00:56:10,945

We'll make sure to link

it in the show notes.

:

00:56:11,005 --> 00:56:11,245

Megan Hjelmstad: Thanks.

:

00:56:12,445 --> 00:56:13,375

Mari Wagner: Thank you, Megan.

:

00:56:13,580 --> 00:56:14,020

Megan Hjelmstad: bless you.

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About the Podcast

Ever Be
A faith and lifestyle podcast.
The Ever Be Podcast is a faith and lifestyle podcast filled with meaningful conversations and practical tips that will inspire and empower you to live a Christ centered life in today’s modern world. Through her own experience of surrendering completely to God and finding true fullness of life, your host Mari Wagner, has committed to having God’s praise “ever be” on her lips and sharing that message with the world. Listen in for insightful, real life conversations and actionable steps on how to claim the full life God created you for.

With over 100K followers and counting, Instagram content creator and founder of the popular Catholic lifestyle brand, West Coast Catholic, Mari Wagner is showing the world how to live a bold, attractive, and fulfilling Catholic life by being in the world but not of it. On the podcast you’ll get a combination of heartfelt solo episodes with Mari, interviews with exciting guests, and up-close and personal time with both the Wagner’s—Mari and Trey. What more could you ask for?!

Finally! Answers to questions you’ve been asking like:
How do I infuse prayer into my daily life? How do I live out my Catholic faith? What is the best dating and marriage advice? What does a good Catholic marriage look like? How do I grow in homemaking skills and build a domestic church? How do I create a beautiful and welcoming home? What does a healthy and balanced lifestyle look like? Is it possible to find a solid community of like minded women?

Host Mari Wagner covers topics that you actually care about from faith life, to relationships and marriage, to homemaking, to healthy living. Each episode is crafted to resonate with your challenges and aspirations as a modern Christian woman seeking purpose, balance, and joy.

Tune into the Ever Be Podcast for valuable advice, relatable stories, expert insights and just some fun girl chats with someone who really gets you. Hit play to get out of the rut you constantly feel yourself in, and subscribe to join the community and experience the fullness of life Jesus has in store for you.

About your host

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Mari Wagner